[SimonB]

... the Business Manager at my Dealership. Trying to get them to return my emails or call me proactively before the last minute is like pulling teeth.

They sure don't like an educated buyer either, the info they give you is scant, and that's a good description.

All I want to know is: What's the going base or starting rate? What's the EPP discount (this used to be published, it's not now, apparently and is kept secret, BMW won't tell you, I asked them), this will then result in an effective rate. Then, what rate will the dealer and BMW do between them to get my business?

That's all I want and ask for.

But no, it's apparently too hard. I get told "Yes we gone (sic) down below EPP discounts. Epp (sic) discount would have brought you to 6.80%" So, the 6.30% you offered me on Friday was .05% off that because of what? And all that talk on Friday of "Let me know what rate you get back from your broker and I will talk to BMW" was what? Hot air?

The dealer seems to get $550 for doing this ("Dealer Originatioin Fee") and BMW get $395 (Loan Establishment Fee). Money for jam, I wish my hourly rate was so easily earned. Guess I'd better get back to it!

[SimonB]

PS: Vent over...

[Ichiro]

...I feel for you mate.

From my experience, when they're asked any hard questions about the finance rates and applicable discounts, they'll stall & stall...and then stall some more in regards to giving any concrete numbers.

Finally at the last minute you'll be forced to go into the stealership where they'll wear you down with further crap and finally hope that you'll just crack and give in without too many questions.

Edited

[David328M-Sport]

Originally Posted by SimonB

All I want to know is: What's the going base or starting rate? What's the EPP discount (this used to be published, it's not now, apparently and is kept secret, BMW won't tell you, I asked them), this will then result in an effective rate. Then, what rate will the dealer and BMW do between them to get my business?

That's all I want and ask for.

So you keep at them if they want your business. If you want them to want your business. Otherwise engage another finance company you can deal successfully with.

Originally Posted by Ichiro

...I feel for you mate.

From my experience, when they're asked any hard questions about the finance rates and applicable discounts, they'll stall & stall...and then stall some more in regards to giving any concrete numbers.

Finally at the last minute you'll be forced to go into the stealership where they'll wear you down with further crap and finally hope that you'll just crack and give in without too many questions.

Edited

Yep, they (and other big conglomerates - insurance companies) will try to wear you down. I agree.

Wear them down.

Simon, find some time to go into the dealer late in the day, sit down quietly to go through any and all figures, play a little ignorant and just quietly keep at them till they want to leave & go home.

That's when you get started. "Oh, I don't quite understand." Alternatively, "Oh, I see, it's like this..." Then deliberately make a mistake in your calculations. This will make them explain it again and again. Perhaps this approach will wear them down. Just ensure you get what you want in the end.

You may need to leave without resolution, but if you can spare your time to waste their time or make them work for the extra money, you never know what you might achieve.

Do you have an alternate plan?

[jctg]

Is it because you ordered your car and had to wait several months that finance was not sorted at the same time?

I don't actually have any experience in that regard - when I had my X1 it was an order but finance was done elsewhere. When I got my 328i it was a floor stock so the buying and the financing was basically one negotiation. We never ever mentioned the car price, only monthly payment, term duration and residuals.

I think the fact that you have ordered a car that you are obliged to pick up to some extent put you in a weaker bargaining position for the financing with BMW.

Which would be a good lesson for me when I look to replace my current car.

[SimonB]

Thanks guys, all good points. Won't be able to answer in detail at the moment, or until far later today, but I like David328M-Sport's suggestion.

jctq, I have a $5000 deposit down but a clause that says "Subject to finance acceptable to the purchaser", so that could be an interesting scenario. It really pissed me off that the Finance dept wouldn't properly negotiate with me until a week before delivery, so, buying off the floor would be a totally different story, I agree.

I could walk and leave the $5000, but we all know (including the dealer) that that isn't going to happen.

The Finance broker's going to have a play and see what he can come up with. Don't want to go into details here, but it doesn't seem to be as easy as it looked on the terms I wanted through Macquarie, so that avenue's closed. So, the fallback plan is 6.3% with BMW, which isn't THAT bad.

Having said that, a visitor I have here from Finland just about choked on his lunch when I told him 6% interest rates...

[jctg]

Yeah we get screwed on car prices as well as interest rates. But 6.3 is not too bad. Is that full circle?

[SimonB]

Originally Posted by jctg

Yeah we get screwed on car prices as well as interest rates. But 6.3 is not too bad. Is that full circle?

No FC is max 4 years. I want to do 5, as it's a reasonable time to keep car and it brings the monthly payments down to a comfortable level.

[jctg]

With 5 years you probably want your residual no more than 30%, especially given how loaded your car is. When it is time to sell the car you are very likely to find your options depreciate much quicker than the rest of the car.

Good luck with the finance.

[docsimonm]

Just organise my finance for my 328i coming in the next week or so.

I had a similar rough time getting in contact with the 'business manager', and it wasn't worth my time when I did. All I got was vague answers and estimations.

Went to a broker as well as a specialist bank. Much much better finance with interest rates below 6% and pretty close to my home loan rate (best I talk to the bank about that).

I have a new found love of 'brokers' - my car broker saved me an extra $2k despite my own hard negotiations, and the finance broker beat BMW by a mile.

BMW had one of the most competitive rates for my last car and I went with them. Not this time though...

Give the guys a Stratton Finance a call - I spoke to Nik.

[SimonB]

Originally Posted by docsimonm

Give the guys a Stratton Finance a call - I spoke to Nik.

Thanks docsimonm, I have been dealing with Stratton. Didn't work out thru them this time, for a couple of reasons of my own doing. I tried though, so I am happy :-)