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      11-03-2013, 05:55 PM   #1
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ATS-V vs M3/M4

Is anyone here also waiting to hear more about the (likely) ATS-V which should also be revealed alongside the M3/M4 in Detroit.

There was a good article today in Edmonds about the expected engine to power the little beast which is in the larger CTS v Sport right now.
http://www.edmunds.com/car-reviews/t...cat=affiliates

With the camouflage, I don't think it looks as hot as the M4 does. But its always hard to know http://www.autoblog.com/2013/10/25/c...s-v-spy-shots/
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      11-03-2013, 06:50 PM   #2
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I think the F30 interior looks shit compared to B8 S4 and next gen C Klasse.

Then it suddenly looks classy compared to the ATS.

I don't care about the specs, the ATS interior is about the last place I would ever want to be in. It's unlikely that I'll buy an F80 anytime son, but ATS - not even once.

EDIT: It's not bad, but honestly it's so much like a 2er interior. The M Sport wheel is so much better, and the shift knob just looks terrible.
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      11-03-2013, 07:19 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turbolag View Post
I think the F30 interior looks shit compared to B8 S4 and next gen C Klasse.

Then it suddenly looks classy compared to the ATS.

I don't care about the specs, the ATS interior is about the last place I would ever want to be in. It's unlikely that I'll buy an F80 anytime son, but ATS - not even once.

EDIT: It's not bad, but honestly it's so much like a 2er interior. The M Sport wheel is so much better, and the shift knob just looks terrible.
I don't disagree especially with S5 and new C interiors. But the -V likely will have a more upgraded interior versus the ATS than the changes from the F30/F80.

But I also bet this will have more power than the M3/4 once they have dialed up the LF3.
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      11-03-2013, 09:02 PM   #4
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ATS-V will likely be a great car. The CTS V-Sport is getting great reviews and the prior CTS-V was killer (although large). The comparison with M3/4 will be interesting to see.
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      11-03-2013, 10:08 PM   #5
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Not a Cadillac fan. I don't care if it laps the ring in 6 mins. I buy what I like and speaks to me, the ATS in any trim does not.
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      11-04-2013, 05:35 AM   #6
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GM would be very clever if they brings the range topping V-Models with the new 4.5ltr.V8 variant of the LF3 ... ATS-V with ~500hp and CTS-V with ~600hp !!!
To compete also with the new C63 which most probably first get an 5.5ltr.V8TT N157 variant, if it comes early 2014 - the rumors are that the regular C Class W205 first comes with the same engines as the W204. And all complete new engine including the new I6´s and the new AMG M177 debuts with the new E Class.

Greetings BMW M3 CRT
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      11-04-2013, 05:44 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BMW M3 CRT View Post
GM would be very clever if they brings the range topping V-Models with the new 4.5ltr.V8 variant of the LF3 ... ATS-V with ~500hp and CTS-V with ~600hp !!!
To compete also with the new C63 which most probably first get an 5.5ltr.V8TT N157 variant, if it comes early 2014 - the rumors are that the regular C Class W205 first comes with the same engines as the W204. And all complete new engine including the new I6´s and the new AMG M177 debuts with the new E Class.

Greetings BMW M3 CRT
It's not just about numbers.
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      11-04-2013, 06:51 AM   #8
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It's definitely on my watch list.
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      11-04-2013, 07:13 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTT26 View Post
It's not just about numbers.
Agree ... an M3 was never about numbers, but much about engine fascination, but if I get to the opinion that ~430hp is enough für an new F8x M3/M4 then I stay with the great and unique N/A S65, look if I can get the fuel consuption a little bit lower and market the car over the great and unique and special engine ... and the lower weight.

In this case no one would care about numbers ... and don´t forget an M3 was also never about torque numbers!

BUT if I decide to bring an new engine, than I must orientate this decision also on the cars I will compete with - not hp wise but concept wise! So in my opinion an 4.0ltr.V8TT based on the S63Tü - bore and stroke like S55 and with the same "lightweight" features was the way to go.

If the base C205 gets really ~100kg lighter and the C205 AMG C63 even a little bit more ... and than this car gets an V8TT with ~500+hp than I fear this car was the first AMG that beats an M3(M4) also on track ... and than the last and best argument for the M3 as the "best trackcar in its class" will be gone ... with little chance to react because of the engine limitations.

Than it would be clever if they could argue with an more racier engine like the S65 ... and that an M3 is nothing about numbers.


Greetings BMW M3 CRT
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      11-04-2013, 08:08 AM   #10
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I mostly think it's cool that the General has picked up its game to the extent that this car 'may' actually be a serious contender in this space.

Heck if I could deal with a two seater, I would probably have happily just ordered the new vette instead.
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      11-04-2013, 09:12 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chicochico View Post
I mostly think it's cool that the General has picked up its game to the extent that this car 'may' actually be a serious contender in this space.

Heck if I could deal with a two seater, I would probably have happily just ordered the new vette instead.
I drove a C7 on Friday, it's one hell of a car!
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      11-04-2013, 09:31 AM   #12
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Cadillac has some of the worst design language of any car brand. I understand wanting to be different and unique amongst your competitors but if you're going to do that then people have to like it...
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      11-04-2013, 12:33 PM   #13
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I drove a C7 on Friday, it's one hell of a car!
Just wait for the Z06 and ZR-1, They will put a hurt on most Supercars.
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      11-04-2013, 02:36 PM   #14
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Just wait for the Z06 and ZR-1, They will put a hurt on most Supercars.
The old ZR-1 did that. Heck even the 'pig' Camaro ZL-1 puts many exotics/supercars to shame.
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      11-04-2013, 03:22 PM   #15
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I am just happy to see more manufacturers entering this segment. This will only make the cars better which means better choices for us consumers.

Anyway, BMW M division knows what they are doing when it comes to driving dynamics. M3 is always the best in class for driving feel and precision, although it might give up some in power department to the likes of C63 AMG and ATS-V. Unless other competitors figure out what they are doing, I think M3/M4 will be my first choice.
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      11-04-2013, 04:00 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
It's definitely on my watch list.
Are you allowed to be a mod making those kind of statements lol jk
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      11-04-2013, 04:47 PM   #17
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Have owned an E90 M3 previously and spent some time in an ATS. I think it is a great platform and the upcoming V Series will be a serious competitor. The main thing holding the standard ATS back right now is the 2.0's sound. John Deere is what comes to mind when revving the thing out. Other than that, handling and ride are both fantastic. The interior, despite what some people on here say, it very well done. Interior room is limited especially in the rear.
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      11-04-2013, 07:57 PM   #18
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The ATS-V loses out to the M3 on interior space. The M3 has significantly more rear seat room. If that weren't the case, I'd consider the ATS-V, but I need to use the car for business, and I carry real adults in the back from time to time. No contest.
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      11-05-2013, 05:11 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by richardg View Post
Are you allowed to be a mod making those kind of statements lol jk
Haha, well, also on the list are C205 AMG, Lexus RC-F, 2015 Mustang GT350, 2016/17 Camaro SS/ZL1. Not to mention two seaters like the Z51 or Z06 and the next Nissan Z. How's that for blasphemy?
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      11-05-2013, 08:29 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
Haha, well, also on the list are C205 AMG, Lexus RC-F, 2015 Mustang GT350, 2016/17 Camaro SS/ZL1. Not to mention two seaters like the Z51 or Z06 and the next Nissan Z. How's that for blasphemy?
Variety is the spice of life...
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      11-05-2013, 10:33 AM   #21
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The ATS is, fundamentally, a better driver's car than the f30 right now. It's more connected to drive, trim to trim. Part of that is because it's smaller - it's got a backseat closer to an e46 than an f30.

BMW is working with an e39-sized 3-series when making the f80 M. It's going to have some challenges and the ATS-V may be able to produce a more track-oriented vehicle at the end of the day.

Personally, I didn't care for the ATS at all until I drove one back to back with a f30. I still like the f30 more for day to day, but the ATS was the backroad bomber.

That being said, the ATS may lose it's magic when given tons of power. We shall see.
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      11-07-2013, 08:22 PM   #22
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Rumors...
http://rumors.automobilemag.com/cadi...#axzz2k15WEezO
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