Anyone in UK replaced runflats yet?

[Z4Mr]

Hi guys,
I'm finding the RFTs a pain in the a$$!
SOOOO: Questions.
1) Are Internet rumours/claims I've read that my car's suspension is designed/specced SPECIFICALLY to run with RFTs true or is this just GARBAGE (as I suspect)?
2) IF I opt to stay with RFTs, are Conti Pro Contact RFTs SIGNIFICANTLY better ride-wise than the Bridgestone Potenza REO50s currently fitted to my car?
3) Or should I just trash RFTs altogether and fit non-RFTs and, if so, what brand/make is best for the car? Pirelli PZeros or Michelin Pilots or other??
(I appreciate I'll need to tell my insurer if I go to non-RFTs and also that the tyre-pressure-sensing-equipment would need replacing in any tyre mended at the roadside with a foam mobility kit - a la Z4M for example.)
Cheers in advance for any replies/info,
Mike

[Z4Mr]

OK so maybe NOT!!
Some things I've learned that may help others (cos I'm NICE like that).
1) Whilst most insurers will be absolutely fine with changing to RFTs, BMW will claim that changing OEM runflats for normal tyres will invalidate this warranty. Whilst strictly true, BMW WOULD be left having to refute your warranty claim by establishing in court that the fault on your car being claimed for under warranty had resulted as a result of the tyre change... very VERY difficult for them to do in practice. (I'd imagine that NON run-flats would, if ANYTHING, make the suspension, steering AND FTM the rest of the car LESS liable to go wrong since the jolting and banging thru the car would be reduced!)
2) BMW assert that the suspension and steering on the 135i was developed/calibrated around the OEM runflat. I can only guess that they are referring primarily to slightly softened spring rates to try to counteract the stiffer tyres. That said, I personally doubt that putting non run-flats on the car would be in any way significantly/noticably detrimental to the cars' handling/safety.
3) NON run-flat tyres for the 135i (especially the 215/40R18 front) are VERY hard to come by as a set given the unusual tyre sizes chosen by BMW for the car. Unless you go to slightly different sizes from standard, the choice is more or less limited to Toyo TR-1s or Falkens - neither of which is as well known (to me at least) as the usual Michelins, Pirellis, Contis etc.
4) Whilst almost definately safer in the event of a sudden drastic puncture, such punctures are (thankfully) in practice relatively rare further to which anecdotal Internet forum discussion suggests that run-flats are MORE likely to pick up punctures from nails/screws/get damaged by potholes than are ordinary tyres (although damage to RFTs can be mitigated by keeping the tyres fully/properly inflated - 2.7bar/40psi front and rear for the 135i).
5) Many 1 series, 3 series and 5 series owners who junk their RFTs and go to NON-RFTs invariably claim a much better ride. Whilst I suspect that this is the case, I do wonder to what extent. If I went to the trouble and expense of junking mine and put ordinary tyres on I would certainly be trying to tell/kid myself - and everyone else - that the ride was much better.... would it REALLY be THAT much better in reality being strictly objective?? Especially given that it is widely held that the later generation of RFTs are undoubtedly much better in this regard than earlier/initial efforts and, lets face it, M-Sport suspension with 35 or 40 profile tyres is gonna be a pretty stiff/firm set-up anyway even with NON-RFT tyres!
6) Just remember if junking RFTs that your car will need to have them back on come trade-in time or - more especially - handback (think PCP/lease) or else BMW will chip you between £500-1000 for the trouble of them 'having' to re-equip the car with RFTs.
7) Much anecdotal evidence is also out there on the Internet suggesting that RFTs perform much better all round when a) NEW cos they have a full depth of tread block to take some of the hard bang out of any sharp road defects and also when b) they are warm and the rubber is a bit grippier and more compliant - they tyre compound tends to be a bit 'plasticier' (and thus more rigid/'skitteryier') at temperatures of less than 6 degrees C.
ALL THAT SAID, and FWIW, I'm going to stick with standard Bridgestone RE050 RFTs for the time being. Whilst undoubtedly a bit on the firm side, the ride in my 135iCA is neverthless considerably better than the 19" RFT ride was in my 06/56 E92 335d and also quite a bit better than was the ride in my 07/07 Z4MR on 18" NON-RFTs.
Cheers all,
Mike

[moff]

The RFT's are still sh1t though.

I agree with many of your points and as a leased car driver, I will have to stick to the RFT's.

My rears are currently at 2-3mm and I have virtually no rear traction in this weather, accelerating is a joke.

I am really dissappointed with the cold / wet weather traction that the RFT's provide.

The upside is that I feel reassured that if I get a blow-out on the motorway or at speed things should be easier to recover.

We have also got a 335d running the 19" RFT's and I think the traction is much better, but the ride is awful.

[clived]

I notice Pirelli - PZero Nero's are available in 215/40R18W - anyone want to tell me the size of the rear so I can check their availability without having to go out in the cold to take a look? ;-)

[moff]

Rears are 245/35 ZR18's

I still need some new ones... got done out of the lights by an EVOVII, as I had no traction and the roads was greasy

[123D-M]

I find the ride on my 123d with 18" RFT's awful. It crashes over bumps as there is no give in the tyre at all. I had a WRX STi before and the ride was a lot better than my BMW. I also find the grip in the cold is not good at all.

I'll be making the switch to non-RFT when these tyres are worn. Cheaper too!

[clived]

Originally Posted by moff

Rears are 245/35 ZR18's

...which aren't available as PZero Nero's - damn.

[clived]

Hmmm... Proxes T1-R's?

[moff]

The Proxes are okay, had them on a previous Audi S3.

Problem was that they do not wear very well.

The thing I can't get from my head about the RFT's is that if I have a blow out at 100mph, the outcome is so much better with them rather than non-RFT's.

The other problem is warranty - apparently it does cause issues with BMW!!

[MattD]

I'm really noticing the lack of traction on the slimy roads now, especially when the tyres are stone cold.

I've had traction control blinking quite some way through second whilst not going flat out a few times recently. Never had any problems when it was dry and warmer though.

I want to switch to non-RFTs when the time comes, but I can't believe BMW will potentially start titting around on the warranty aspect.

[clived]

The other option I can find appears to be Continental SportContact 2 - any opinions?

[FazerBoy]

What possible issue might not be covered under warranty if the tyres are changed to non-rfts?

Jack

[creepy coupe]

I read a recent article in Autocar not so long ago, where one of the writers took the mags long term 135i to France and met up with Frank sytner, who also owned/ran and black 135i, Sytner had swapped the RFT's for normal and couldn't believe how it had transformed the car, in both ride and handling, so BMW might have tweaked the 135 to suit RFT's, but if you believe the article, things still improved on normal tyres.

[moff]

No doubt dealer bullsh1t, but the suspensions, wheels and a few other bits and bobs have been configured for the extra stiff side-walls on the RFT's.

BMW Recovery will not collect a car that has a flat either.

[creepy coupe]

Originally Posted by moff

.

BMW Recovery will not collect a car that has a flat either.

Not even if the RFT's has failed?

[clived]

Originally Posted by moff

No doubt dealer bullsh1t, but the suspensions, wheels and a few other bits and bobs have been configured for the extra stiff side-walls on the RFT's.

BMW Recovery will not collect a car that has a flat either.

Have they said that in writing? I'm sure I read somewhere (on the internet, obviously :-) ) the other day that the reverse was true - what's your source here Moff?

Not that I'm bothered, I'm an AA member too.....

[MattD]

Originally Posted by clived

The other option I can find appears to be Continental SportContact 2 - any opinions?

Only experience with them was on my bro's Clio 172 vs the Michelin Pilot Exaltos I had on my old 172 (I know, very sad that we both had the same car but it was bloody good).

Decent tyre but some way short of the Michelins on feel and grip I felt

[Z4Mr]

Originally Posted by moff

No doubt dealer bullsh1t, but the suspensions, wheels and a few other bits and bobs have been configured for the extra stiff side-walls on the RFT's.

BMW Recovery will not collect a car that has a flat either.

Not strictly true - according to what I've been told at any rate. Two weeks ago BMW Emergency Services (Bob Smith) told me that BMW WOULD recover my 135i WITH NON-RFTs PROVIDING that I'd already tried to fix the flat with a BMW MOBILITY KIT (a la Z4M). But ONLY if I'd been carrying and tried (unsuccessfully obviously) to use a BMW product i.e. NOT a ContiComfortKit or other non-BMW kit. That said and in any event, and like Clived above, I'm also in the AA and they inform me that they'd recover me with NON-RFTs providing my car doesn't have designated space for a spare - which it obviously doesn't! And I'm absolutely certain that the AA would have a WAAAAAAY easier time getting me going with a new NON-RFT than a virtually-impossible-to-buy-off-the-shelf OEM RFT.....

ALL THAT said, I'm still on RFTs cos despite NEVER having thankfully had a high speed blow-out, I still like the idea that the RFTs will stand me in good stead if that ever happens....... Then again; I ran over a small stone (50mm round or so) the other day at about 50mph and boy did it resonate harshly thru the car.... And I do wonder if I hit a pothole in the dark in a remote locality just how effectively (i.e. soon) I'd get back on the road if the RFT was totalled...... A contact of mine has just got some Falken 452s on his 135i and I'm hoping to try his car soon: then I'll decide whether or not to ditch the RFTs.....

Mike

[Vidge]

Please let us know the out come when you have driven it, as i would be very interested.

cheers

Vidge

[biscuits]

Originally Posted by moff

The Proxes are okay, had them on a previous Audi S3.

Problem was that they do not wear very well.

The thing I can't get from my head about the RFT's is that if I have a blow out at 100mph, the outcome is so much better with them rather than non-RFT's.

The other problem is warranty - apparently it does cause issues with BMW!!

It's no argument for BMW really....... maybe ask them "so why do ALL M cars come with standard tyres and a puncture repair kit then....!!!!

We have run-flats on our 130 and they are utter rubbish, crashy and no traction if you hit the smallest of stones/catseye.... utter carp !

[mad chemist]

Originally Posted by moff

Rears are 245/35 ZR18's

I still need some new ones... got done out of the lights by an EVOVII, as I had no traction and the roads was greasy

I'm the same Moff,

Already down to ~3 mm at the rear after only 11,000 miles and finding these bloody greasy roads hell. I almost got taken at the lights by a 335d on the way hope on Monday night - I had the traction control light coming on in 1, 2 and 3rd gear (even changing up early from 1st). My old E46 M3 never seemed to have such problems getting the power down under these conditions and the rears lasted well into 18,000 miles before they even looked close to the wear indicators (got to blame the SSTT for most of these traction problems, I think).

Here's looking forward to the summer.

Mad.

[esscolab]

Mad, not sure this is purely down to the run flats... lack of LSD with these cars doesn't help at all.