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      06-11-2016, 07:58 AM   #1
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M2 vs Focus RS vs Audi RS3 vs AMG A45: Auto Bild Sports Cars July 2016

Finally it's there! The most comprehensive comparo of these cars (Germans are very good at these).

Bear with the google translate below, I am too lazy to do a proper translation
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      06-11-2016, 07:59 AM   #2
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Google translation:

In principle, this is what we on the
following pages extend a
pretty serious matter. It
comes to the final ranking
in the compact segment; about who
really the most hott Hatch
builds; or whether this Hotteste now
not rather a coupe
is. It's about lap times,
Sprint values, braking distances to driving impressions
and also about who the
jump most performance for your money
leaves. Now runs here but also
the new Ford Focus RS with. And
who is even vaguely still working
recalls what impressive
Confetti firework his predecessor
once honed, can actually
count them on one finger, that it
without Gaudi this time
will not expire.
nevertheless we try, the number
objectively tackle. As the
Ford himself, who in the third generation
now final, Frontantriebs-
Comedian for four-wheel-rival
blossomed. His spoiler and
Schwellerornat is no longer
only the presentation, but the first time
well balanced aerodynamics.
The powertrain works
with external coolers
Brembo stoppers are 30 racetrack
Minutes at a time through;
Front and rear suspension
were significantly stiffer
executed the Adaptivfahrwerk
neatly spiced up while
the forged 19-inch model
again expensive with 1000 Euro Sport rubber
let recap.
Really important, however, are
Two other factors that character the
Focus of shape. On the one hand
the new 2.3-liter EcoBoost four-cylinder,
of the old five-cylinder
in terms of responsiveness, power delivery
and consumption over
worthy heir, emotional but then
but not quite in his footsteps
flairt. Not misunderstand: The
Way as he growls a (sound amplified) from the front as he
through double pipe snarls and
Load change drauflosknattert than
if someone had a battery Silvester firecrackers
ignited, the already turnt
at. Only echoes unshaven Joe-
Cocker timbre of once simple
still peppy after, as that
on the other hand he angrölen seriously
could.
Point two hits the nail for
fully upside down. This refers to the
Four-wheel drive, the 350 hp and
440 - in overboost 470 - Newton meters
now equal purposeful
recycled, without, however, to
to hit the driving pleasure. On the contrary.
The system is rather
Lynchpin equal more
Handling aspects, which
along the individual drive modes
defoliate. Because unlike
conventional hang-on solutions
which always with a four-wheel coupling
work on the rear axle,
has the Focus the two, and
this he can still completely to
separately adjustable.
Active, continuously and fully variable up
towards the extreme case where only one
Wheel on the rear axle drives.
What happens then can be
beautiful on Ford's Youtube Channel
empathize, on so few
Copies wild räuchernd around pylons
gyrate. And yes: The quote
its developers, according to which the "Drift
Mode "many bad drivers surprisingly
look good, can
We only confirm at this point.
Well of course you can
be divided on what such a
Mode is that one good conscience
only to be unlock protected route
can ignite if the domestic
Tire Delivery times again
take livingroom threatened;
on the other hand fits all the
Acting but quite perfect
to Focus, the yes never be
has sheared to conventions, as long as
the Gaudi true. And this is also true in the more civil
Modes. Yes, even the civilians
of all, the "Normal Mode".
Okay, you still sitting a little
excessive, more on top than in the middle.
But for a suction cups
The standard sports seats
so the action that you look
1600 Euro for shell stalls
can give confidently. And so brezelt
one then on the home track.
The jagged steering in
Left, the crystal clear
guided
Circuit on the right, the
Four quick-tempered final at the
Sole, banquets in the visor, while
the wheel subtly from the
Background controls, very classic
as traction insurance.
As Ideal highway crystallizes
However, only the "Sport
Mode "out of the Steering
again nachzurrt, response
and sound and goads
with the wheel now noticeable in the
Curve drallt once you the 1.6 bar
Boost pressure fire on the dance floor. The
Whole thing feels
a bit
by Evo and
significantly more agile than all the other
Hang-ons.
Were to remain final nor the "Track Mode"
Ford, however, only on closed
Routes recommended. And
honestly? Even there we had
our concerns. Not because of the
Allrads who in "Track" actually
even more sensational levers from behind,
but because of putting
Attenuation that the Focus such
brutal tightly clamped onto the base,
that the crew at every even
so small bump
herumhopst like a
Wackeldackel on Epo.
Not pushing his hard pimple
need here in order to feel well and
on the other hand shows the Audi, dynamics
on significantly more subtle way
scatters. It may be that he sometimes
a bit of support in
Suspension is missing, but compensated for the
the Ingolstadt then right
elegant by movement. A slight prance already for
Braking, the never nervous,
but more agile feel. By
the bold impulse to him the
Wheel are to relent. Or
by the slight Lastwechselschlenzer,
which almost maddeningly
Relaxed from its backbone
let pluck.
And then all the rest:
the incredible precision direct steering,
the flaky pedal feel,
the exact double couplers
the haptic delight landscape;
all highly
beguiling. Frivolous's on the other hand only
the five-cylinder; especially then,
when the same on its optional
Sports exhaust airs that such
shamelessly drauflosorchestert,
that you actually a FSKKennzeichnung
paperboard the stern
takes. Herb Dark tubes
to train, bronchial coughing in
Load change,
ballerndes declutching
when downshifting and this
dirty upshift belch
reloading -
terrific. And
is here
the Audi even just
in the middle of the facelift; so is
it did not even play,
that he has them again a little
more curve sharpness brings.
Straight has Neckarsulm contrast
little to optimize.
465 Newton meters as wildfire
1625-5550 Tours, 367 hp
permanent foothills above. To
seven aptly splayed courses
and a Launch Control that their
3800 tours courageously right on the
Wheel coupling. 3.9
Seconds to hundred, 14.8
to two hundred. Volunteers before!
can counter some extent the
only the BMW M2, the fulminant the
aufspielenden Audi again
more rotatory power encounters.
And, although he not only
rear driven, but this time
even hand connected to
Bet Sprint competes. Already clear that
may sound a bit dowdy, costing him two hundred but
just one tenth. Especially
because the hand control with
BMW still used as a dyed in the wool
may be sports transmission.
Even the Reihensechser motorized
the manner of his duties. Or
to put it better: the manner of his
Origin. Indeed, contrary to
M3 / M4-engine, which as Biturbo
is used completely new,
is the M2 motor of a modified
M235i unit produced.
Quite so feverish smacks of Single-
ie Turbo not up, but
it runs cultured, it sounds
creamy, and he speaks in comparison
to its stronger siblings
minimally worse at. Ever
pumping the BMW in terms
Passage here so fast nobody
something before.
And who knows this better than the
A 45? He who with 381 hp and 475
Nm nominally highest
is the price, but in fact
also most toil for
have to be. Up to 1.8 bar paddles his
Twinscroll handlers in the two-liter.
And until he beisammenhat which passes
sometimes a small moment.
In the lower gears you realize
of which very little is because the
Speed ​​jumps plugged extremely short
are and the hole in accordance with
good disguise. In the higher
Transitions exists between full throttle
and full load but then a
quite noticeable lag.
To start violence rips the
AMG all the more courageous together.
He couples a hardest,
plucks obsessed by the first
Courses and adheres so at least
160 km / h before the speed increased
BMW. Still dubbed this
he the little beauty mark in
its power delivery with a
also brilliant acoustics
Show! Tubes, bangs, Sprotzeln,
Gargling, sometimes solo, sometimes together,
and more. And the Focus? The asking once
to search the central display.
Submenu driver assistance. There,
where otherwise only track holder and
cavort distance warning, dormant
in his case, namely also
Launch Control, which by itself
their baller ends staging ago
easy WRC-fit would be. coupling
let fly, and the Focus
shoots with a relatively large front wheel slip
in 4.8 seconds on a hundred.
find the promised 4.7
on the other hand. only on private roads
Then, when the four-cylinder
even rammed against the wheel,
what the 1.55 tons of little frictional
bursts forward.
Ultimately, however, it does not matter whether
4.8 or 4.7 seconds. Because the
Race after losing the Ford
abundantly clear. Although he subjectively
properly zünftig get you going, and decided
revs up, he does
mercilessly end either with the
fiery Audi yet with the highly elastic
BMW nor
with the continued vehement
AMG compete. Yes, even the Focus
RS 500 by once was between 100
and 200 km / h 0.2 tenths faster.
On the route saw the for
more older. And that is not
only the wheel alone, but also
with all the components which it
to work. Why of course, the
Semi Slicks count that the front axle
a really sharp turn-in
bestow, while
the rear axle at the same time sufficiently
give guidance to the
Shear force pulse to shoulder. Of the
Focus scurries corresponding neutral
in curves into it, always remains directionally stable,
reliably and in spite of its
rear-emphasized agility free from malice.
All the best, then, would there
not again the problem with
the modes. The "Track" set-up is
even at Sachsenring too stiff,
bucks on curbs and under braking
so around that between
even the ABS gets out.
Significantly smoother it runs contrary
in "Sport Mode", the more
Movement permits, but the stern
not quite as adept behind bends.
And the "Drift Mode"? Okay, we
give it to: have also with him
we ventured a fast lap, which
The name, however, too much
Program was when that valorizable
would come of it.
formulated exaggeration, feels
"Drift" at as if you a
strutting cart behind.
Even in coasting phases are the
Wheel as much drag torque on
the rear axle, that the same practical
slips on every steering impulse towards.
The Audi plaguing however quite different
To care. And the concern before
especially its front axle, which it
Soaps too early to understeer,
as he profitably his Punch
could exploit. Nice
clear, with a quattro brings you
time does not curve at the outset, but
more from apex. But that applies
unfortunately, only as long as the curves of
foreseeable duration. By "stubby"
Corners comes the RS 3 right
along well. Just what good is it if
one of the Sachsenring mostly
elongated radii set before, in
which then understeer and oversteer alternate part repeatedly?
Let's hope so times on Facelift
- And that it is also the
Condition of the original brakes improved.
With its stoppers has the AMG
no problem. But on the contrary:
His steel belongs more to the top,
whereupon anchor in this class
can. The Dynamic Plus package
Adaptivfahrwerk and Vorderachssperre
has also been proven,
just like the Aero Package
and the bucket seats. New, however, are
the semi slicks, he today
first transmits to it the BMW
not so easy to do. Purely
calculation should thus actually
also a low 1: 38er Round
be possible, considering,
that he on road tires ever
1: has gezeitet 38.97 minutes.
However, there would already one
slightly higher mathematics have needed
herauszurechnen this Delta.
Compared to then,
as he always delicate mitlenkend the
Radii pfeilte, the AMG missing time
just a little looseness.
His stern sits too quiet,
what vorderachsbetonte Handling
further strengthened and
Sport tire advantage thus virtually
equalized. Too bad, with a more aggressive
Axle geometry would certainly
been gloss Fuller possible.
Small consolation: The BMW
comes this time not quite to his
last mythical time zoom. In his case,
is not there but on the daily form,
but rather on his hand circuit,
the one for some corners
is translated little unhappy. space
the technology Fritzen, who now happily
hineinjubilieren in itself, is
but said: The round "of
Hand "yet the greater pleasure!
Simply because they driver to
closer ties to the action. And
that's what it's all in one
Coupé, which with its driving dynamics
Paces lives. The width
Track, the stiff kinematics, the tight
LG, the balanced
Axle loads, the balanced finely
Steering, active suspension. All this
adds up to a driving dynamics
extremely cohesive whole. Just
should go to this whole thing
also can. Because, as almost every
M also tends the M2 at the limit
to oversteer. And that is due
the tight wheelbase long
not as predictable as with an M3 or M4. In contrast to those
the usually gentle in duration Slide
can hold, can the
Corrections in M2 therefore somewhat
fail extensive.
On the road turns
on the other hand the sheet: compact, articulated,
footed, to awake
motorized and smoky voiced.
In short: driving pleasure at its best,
the M2 offers there. All
otherwise the Ford, which in principle
nothing makes after textbook on
End but at the same
Fun factor comes out. Because he
seriously now, can be so
but still not to
seriously. Therein lies the
Dichotomy of the AMG a little
plagues. The hardly affords performance
Schnitzer, but also acts
as if he would never be a
want to make. The Audi sees the
hand thing relaxed: Go
one because it all the material Gourmets
anyway terrific about its
crafted knob handles. To the
other but also because BMW, Ford
and Mercedes-AMG perhaps a
higher lateral dynamics, so
but far no five-cylinder
(More) offer.

FUN MUST REIN!
If it were just about the Gaudi,
we would have the first place probably actually
allocated twice. Go to a
BMW, the perhaps the best with the M2
create fun-athletes of modern times
have; on the other hand to Ford,
their Focus RS entirely new and yet
somehow all the old things. This krawallbüchsige
All-wheel-tuning, this lowbrow
Spoiler outfit, this cheeky
Ballermann-acoustics - that has something special!
Or you may know another
Car that can Frührentner again
can become teenagers? Just!
If one sees a thing the
little rational, must
However, to say that the second
only thus stirred Place of Ford that, besides
all performance up and the
Price is right. Straight and to the
Route bagged him the eindimensionalere something
couragiert for right curving
AMG. The ultimate acceleration lobe
on the other hand also vibrates
continue the Audi RS 3, the five-cylinder
almost even the BMW engine outshines.
Only true when M2 evenly also
all the rest.
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      06-13-2016, 08:47 AM   #3
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Thanks for posting! Nicely written, but still, not on the level of an evo comparison, for example.

I kinda miss the "introduction" of the M2 in the text. The author writes a lot about the Focus, a lot about the RS3...and little to nothing about the M2. He is just comparing it to the others but there is no dedicated M2 section.

Other than that, the laptime of the M2 with 6MT is amazing, especially when compared against the AMG (equipped with Cup 2s!). The Audi...well, that reflects my impressions of a test drive I had last year in a RS3. It's just another Audi - fast in a straight line, but not willing to oversteer or stay even neutral when pushed hard. At least the engine is glorious.
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      06-13-2016, 10:58 AM   #4
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Funny the new and thoroughly developed Focus RS is 18000 euros cheaper then the manual M2... I guess that says it all about the "premium" of owning a BMW M nowadays, especially when using a platform probably already amortized with the M3/M4 sales, a motor based on the N55 and a normal 2 series interior...

Concerning the RS, as far as I'm concerned, pity for the reduced trunk space (only 260 l for a 4 doors hatchback due the AWD system) and the slightly high position of the otherwise excellent Recaro seats...

For the rest, "fierce" competition by the two remaining FWD based AWD, automatic 4 pots, what a victory for the M2...
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      06-14-2016, 04:06 AM   #5
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Quite a respectable result from the Focus considering the straight line performance is far from the other cars.
Must be a good testament to how it behaves in the corners.

It seems the test concludes the M2 and Focus are the most fun to drive of the group.

I am also quite pleased with my Focus RS, I picked it up last week, in that respect(narrow back road blasts) but miss a bit of the straight line punch in the straights.

The M2 however is even more fun to drive and for me a more desirable car IMO.
Can´t wait to take delivery of my ordered M2... whenever that will be.

BR

Edit: Both the Focus and the Merc had the Cup tires. This makes the M2 even more impressive IMO.

Last edited by F1zbo; 06-14-2016 at 04:14 AM..
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      06-14-2016, 04:45 AM   #6
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Result.

M2 looks so good in white
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      06-14-2016, 05:18 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F1zbo View Post
Quite a respectable result from the Focus considering the straight line performance is far from the other cars.
Must be a good testament to how it behaves in the corners.

It seems the test concludes the M2 and Focus are the most fun to drive of the group.

I am also quite pleased with my Focus RS, I picked it up last week, in that respect(narrow back road blasts) but miss a bit of the straight line punch in the straights.

The M2 however is even more fun to drive and for me a more desirable car IMO.
Can´t wait to take delivery of my ordered M2... whenever that will be.

BR

Edit: Both the Focus and the Merc had the Cup tires. This makes the M2 even more impressive IMO.
If you careful look at the images there's a picture where you can see the Focus had the optional forged rims but the Pilot Super Sport tyres, not the Cup ones, so I'm not sure about that graphic/information.
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      06-14-2016, 05:34 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyaway View Post
If you careful look at the images there's a picture where you can see the Focus had the optional forged rims but the Pilot Super Sport tyres, not the Cup ones, so I'm not sure about that graphic/information.
Ah, you are correct.
Assuming the same tires where used on the track test the Focus definately performs really well from a track performance PoV.

Br
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      06-14-2016, 08:45 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyaway View Post
Funny the new and thoroughly developed Focus RS is 18000 euros cheaper then the manual M2...
How developed is the Focus in comparison? The M2 doesn't just have shocks, springs and wheels from the M3/4, the entire suspension carriers are modified and bolted directly to the subframe. Then there's the extra bracing, extra oil cooler, sump, more powerful engine with modified internals, differential, different gearbox from standard, etc.

The Focus RS is a hotted up Focus, and very good for the money, however I think it's important to keep in mind that your extra 18000 euros gets you:

1) a BMW
2) a better interior with virtually every option available as standard
3) what is effectively a new chassis compared to standard
4) the exclusivity of a lower production run

Just look at the air vents in the Focus. 'Sir, can we get some new vents? It'll re-' 'No! you will use whatever $%^&ing vents we have lying around! Turn them around or something and make them fit!'

If I couldn't afford an M2, and I totally acknowledge my good fortune in being able to, I would most likely be opting for a heavily modified M-sport 228i over a Focus RS. I've owned lots of FWD and driven front biased AWD cars and they leave me feeling a little cold.
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      06-15-2016, 04:22 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ilovewagons View Post
How developed is the Focus in comparison? The M2 doesn't just have shocks, springs and wheels from the M3/4, the entire suspension carriers are modified and bolted directly to the subframe. Then there's the extra bracing, extra oil cooler, sump, more powerful engine with modified internals, differential, different gearbox from standard, etc.

The Focus RS is a hotted up Focus, and very good for the money, however I think it's important to keep in mind that your extra 18000 euros gets you:

1) a BMW
2) a better interior with virtually every option available as standard
3) what is effectively a new chassis compared to standard
4) the exclusivity of a lower production run

Just look at the air vents in the Focus. 'Sir, can we get some new vents? It'll re-' 'No! you will use whatever $%^&ing vents we have lying around! Turn them around or something and make them fit!'

If I couldn't afford an M2, and I totally acknowledge my good fortune in being able to, I would most likely be opting for a heavily modified M-sport 228i over a Focus RS. I've owned lots of FWD and driven front biased AWD cars and they leave me feeling a little cold.
I think you need to do some reading about the Focus RS.
There are so many statements in your text that are just incorrect.
I actually have a Focus RS since last week as an interim car until I take delivery of my M2 that is on order.

The Focus RS has a specifically developed AWD system that is superior to the FWD biased AWD-systems you seem to think is used on the Focus.
It actually has torque vectoring and the AWD function is adjustable with different driving modes.

The engine is modified, as is the suspension compared to other Ford cars it is being used in. It has adjustable Teneco suspension and a heavily modified rear axle to accommodate the new rear drive unit.
I would not be surprised if Ford has spent more time on development of the new RS than BMW has on the M2, seeing as most of the drive train is carry over from the M3/M4. Nothing wrong in that of course.

Also, please take a look at the lap times above. It is faster on the track than the german AWD rivals despite being low on power and being a manual car.
That in my book is very impressive.

My response the below points you made:
1) a BMW
- Yes, so what? Are we comparing cars and their respective performance or brands/image?

2) a better interior with virtually every option available as standard
- Sure, interior is better than the Focus.
However, only some markets the M2 is fully loaded. Germany is not one of them. I believe this goes for probably all EU countries.

3) what is effectively a new chassis compared to standard
- Same for the RS

4) the exclusivity of a lower production run
- Same for the RS
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      06-15-2016, 06:13 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F1zbo View Post
I think you need to do some reading about the Focus RS.
There are so many statements in your text that are just incorrect.
I actually have a Focus RS since last week as an interim car until I take delivery of my M2 that is on order.

The Focus RS has a specifically developed AWD system that is superior to the FWD biased AWD-systems you seem to think is used on the Focus.
It actually has torque vectoring and the AWD function is adjustable with different driving modes.

The engine is modified, as is the suspension compared to other Ford cars it is being used in. It has adjustable Teneco suspension and a heavily modified rear axle to accommodate the new rear drive unit.
I would not be surprised if Ford has spent more time on development of the new RS than BMW has on the M2, seeing as most of the drive train is carry over from the M3/M4. Nothing wrong in that of course.

Also, please take a look at the lap times above. It is faster on the track than the german AWD rivals despite being low on power and being a manual car.
That in my book is very impressive.

My response the below points you made:
1) a BMW
- Yes, so what? Are we comparing cars and their respective performance or brands/image?

2) a better interior with virtually every option available as standard
- Sure, interior is better than the Focus.
However, only some markets the M2 is fully loaded. Germany is not one of them. I believe this goes for probably all EU countries.

3) what is effectively a new chassis compared to standard
- Same for the RS

4) the exclusivity of a lower production run
- Same for the RS
I think Germany is. I've ordered my M2 with 6MT with "only" ~4k€ in Options. I would spend at least 15k€ on options on a new 440i.

It comes with leather, CF trim inside, navigation professional, auto air con, xenon lights, and so on. You don't need to add anything else, if you just want to drive it and dont need the luxury of connected drive or some other stuff like electric seats (I hate them in my M346 btw and would always choose manually adjustable seats).
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      06-15-2016, 08:12 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F1zbo View Post
I think you need to do some reading about the Focus RS.
There are so many statements in your text that are just incorrect.
I actually have a Focus RS since last week as an interim car until I take delivery of my M2 that is on order.
Sadly, no, I am not wrong. You are trying to compare a car with an engine out of the Mustang ecoboost with a bigger turbo and new heads to an engine with forged internals.

Don't take my word for it, I did plenty of reading about the Focus RS, because I wanted to buy one. Unfortunately for my wallet, it is obvious to anyone with even a rudimentary reading ability that the M2 is superior in terms of engineering. That car is comprehensively engineered. Anyone who thinks that you can just shove M3/4 bits into a 2 series and make an M2 has no idea what they're talking about.

Please see below:
Focus RS - tech overview
M2 - tech overview

Quote:
Also, please take a look at the lap times above. It is faster on the track than the german AWD rivals despite being low on power and being a manual car.
I think you need to go and look at the lap times, because the M2 is up to something like 2 seconds a lap quicker, around a short track, and is faster in every sector, and managed a +10kph top speed as well. I know you like your focus, but surely not enough to abandon literacy.

Last edited by ilovewagons; 06-15-2016 at 08:18 AM..
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      06-15-2016, 08:22 AM   #13
F1zbo
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Originally Posted by eau_rouge View Post
I think Germany is. I've ordered my M2 with 6MT with "only" ~4k€ in Options. I would spend at least 15k€ on options on a new 440i.

It comes with leather, CF trim inside, navigation professional, auto air con, xenon lights, and so on. You don't need to add anything else, if you just want to drive it and dont need the luxury of connected drive or some other stuff like electric seats (I hate them in my M346 btw and would always choose manually adjustable seats).
Sure, it has a lot of equipment as standard compared to other BMWs but it is not fully loaded. That was my point.
If anyone would need to add equipment or not on top of the base spec is a personal choice but it does not mean there aren´t any additional options to tick.

Br
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      06-15-2016, 08:42 AM   #14
F1zbo
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Originally Posted by ilovewagons View Post
Sadly, no, I am not wrong. You are trying to compare a car with an engine out of the Mustang ecoboost with a bigger turbo and new heads to an engine with forged internals.

Don't take my word for it, I did plenty of reading about the Focus RS, because I wanted to buy one. Unfortunately for my wallet, it is obvious to anyone with even a rudimentary reading ability that the M2 is superior in terms of engineering. That car is comprehensively engineered. Anyone who thinks that you can just shove M3/4 bits into a 2 series and make an M2 has no idea what they're talking about.

Please see below:
Focus RS - tech overview
M2 - tech overview



I think you need to go and look at the lap times, because the M2 is up to something like 2 seconds a lap quicker, around a short track, and is faster in every sector, and managed a +10kph top speed as well. I know you like your focus, but surely not enough to abandon literacy.


Ok, if you have read about the Focus RS then I do not understand how you compare the Focus AWD system to Haldex-based competitors and conclude it must be boring like other AWD fron biased cars?
That is the main differentiation from the competition. Is is actually very rear biased when pushing the car through corners.
Have you driven the RS? It feels nothing like a haldex-based AWD-system.
It is so much fun and freakishly fast on tight back roads.

If you read once again what I wrote: "It is faster on the track than the german AWD rivals". The key word here is AWD.
That means compared to the A45 and the RS3. Literacy is hopefully not abandoned quite yet

I can also conclude with my basic level of literacy(English and German not being my first languages) that the M2 is quicker round the track. A fact I have neither disputed nor brought up
Nor have I claimed the Focus is faster in a straight line... Actually the exact opposite a bit further up in the thread.

Neither have I claimed the Focus is superior in terms of engineering compared to the M2.
I simply believe that Ford has spent some serious money on developing this car, especially the AWD drive train, whereas BMW already have a lot of the basic development done in the M2s case.
That does not say anything about the end result. The M2 is superior in most(all) performance oriented areas. But that was not the point.

I personally think the M2 is a better car for me than the Focus in almost every respect but does not make me less impressed of Fords achievement.
Being quicker around this track then A45 and RS3 despite being so low on power and straight line speed is a testament to a great drive train and suspension.

Br
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      06-18-2016, 10:33 PM   #15
ilovewagons
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F1zbo View Post
Ok, if you have read about the Focus RS then I do not understand how you compare the Focus AWD system to Haldex-based competitors and conclude it must be boring.
I never said it was boring, I just said I didn't like it. I hope that is still permitted!

Quote:
If you read once again what I wrote: "It is faster on the track than the german AWD rivals". The key word here is AWD.
That means compared to the A45 and the RS3. Literacy is hopefully not abandoned quite yet
Yes, except the A45 is also faster than the Focus. The Focus RS is faster than the RS3 though. This isn't knocking the car's performance, it's a great achievement, but the fact that a manual M2 is faster than 1 car with an advanced AWD system, and two more powerful AWD cars should be an indication to you of how complete the M2's development has been. It should be slower, but it isn't.

My point to you is that it is far more difficult to take parts from one chassis, modify them to fit another and then engineer the resulting car to be so damn good it can handily deal with more powerful AWD cars, and even its more powerful big brothers on at least one technically demanding track. That took a lot of engineering. I just disagree with what you implied about the 18k difference between the cars not being spent on engineering. Test results clearly show where that money has gone.[/QUOTE]
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