[AMDG]

Posted elsewhere, but soliciting feedback here as well. Just took delivery (ED) of my car three weeks ago, currently awaiting re-delivery. But in the meantime BMW, NA has sent me a customer satisfaction survey regarding the purchase experience, and my CA has proactively reached out to me to let me know how important a perfect score would mean to him as it pertains to his monthly bonus. He asks that I contact him with any concerns before I give him anything less than a perfect "10."

To be honest, there were aspects of the experience that were incredibly off-putting, not the least of which being a near-screaming match over the phone, with him threatening (bluffing really) to cancel the sale, and me daring him to (flight to Munich was already booked). Eventually his sales manager got involved and threw in a couple incentives to try and smooth things over. I won't lie, it left a bitter tasted in my mouth.

That being said, I won't be a dick and mess with his money, especially since he's proactively offering to make whatever wrong right for me in exchange for the perfect score. Aside from the near breakdown in the relationship, he recommended the tire protection package and I went with it (extra $1800), and after reading some of the threads here and elsewhere, realized after the fact that it could have been negotiated down... rookie mistake.

My question is, has anyone else ever been in that situation? Regardless of personal experience, what are some of the things that I could reasonably ask for?

Thanks.

[bimmercar]

you can always get a refund if you cancel the insurance

[435MSport6Speed]

"near-screaming match over the phone, with him threatening (bluffing really) to cancel the sale, and me daring him to (flight to Munich was already booked)."

May we have some additional information on the above before responding?

[AMDG]

Originally Posted by bimmercar

you can always get a refund if you cancel the insurance

Really? Didn't know that. I want to keep it, since it seems it might pay for itself with the 19'' RFTs on my car, but maybe I'll use that info to try and renegotiate the price.

[AMDG]

Originally Posted by paulff3

"near-screaming match over the phone, with him threatening (bluffing really) to cancel the sale, and me daring him to (flight to Munich was already booked)."

May we have some additional information on the above before responding?

I requested one production change to add heated front seats. Aside from that, I had originally selected Bremerhaven as the drop-off location, then contacted him to find out if it were possible to switch the election to another city. He said he doubted it, but that I could contact BMW, NA directly myself and see if it was possible. These were the only changes I made, with the heated front seats being requested right after he sent me his quote, and the change in drop-off inquiry (it wasn't really a request yet) later on in the process. BMW told me the change in drop-off city wasn't a problem, I had up to 7 days before drop-off to change the drop off location, so that wasn't even an issue.

Neither requests were material to the breakdown, and neither required any additional effort or work on his behalf, but more on that in a second. The breakdown came after he suggested I check with BMW Financial services to see if I could get a better interest rate on my loan offer. My offer letter was about to expire and having already extended it once before (the first was probably way too early to be useful, but I wanted to see what I could qualify for and at what rate), I didn't want to have yet another 'hard inquiry' on my credit file.

He had assured me that since the dealership used the same bank as which had quoted me, there would not be a new inquiry into my credit, they'd use the same information the bank had pulled and present me a quote. It was all nonsense of course, but I didn't realize it at the time. Not only did their finance department submit an inquiry with the bank we both use, but also another lender, which I expressly did not authorize. The two hits dropped my credit score 6 points. Perhaps not a big deal, but I'm a stickler for honesty/fair representations.

While I wouldn't say that he deliberately lied to me about what would happen, and I was willing to chalk it up as a him being mistaken as to the process... he took an ultra-defensive position, and tried to argue that he was already doing so much, putting in so much hours and effort into this transaction and barely making any money on the sale. He even stated that it was not worth his while (which is when he threatened to cancel) and pretty much made it seem like he was losing money on the deal and doing me a favor. He even went so far as to accuse me of "being a lawyer" about things.

His supervisor called me later that even and apologized... as did he the next day, but honestly it did little to erase the bad taste in my mouth. He promised to take care of me whenever I come in for service etc. But frankly, I can't take him at his word... that's just my nature, and certainly by training, but also has to do with my past experience with him. One other thing, he tried to have me add the car to my existing insurance policy the day I signed the sale agreement... which didn't seem to make any sense since I wouldn't have the car for at least another six weeks. I confirmed as much with my insurance company... which didn't prove him a liar, but demonstrated that he really wasn't that experienced or knowledgeable about the ED process.

Probably way too much info... but that's really the sum of it, nothing material was left out the first time, and nothing else has been omitted here.

[goj]

I think you need to respond with your honest feedback. Of course they pressure you for 10s. If your experience was not all "10s" don't give it to them. Wait to pick up your car again then fill the survey

[tturedraider]

Originally Posted by AMDG

Posted elsewhere, but soliciting feedback here as well. Just took delivery (ED) of my car three weeks ago, currently awaiting re-delivery. But in the meantime BMW, NA has sent me a customer satisfaction survey regarding the purchase experience, and my CA has proactively reached out to me to let me know how important a perfect score would mean to him as it pertains to his monthly bonus. He asks that I contact him with any concerns before I give him anything less than a perfect "10."

To be honest, there were aspects of the experience that were incredibly off-putting, not the least of which being a near-screaming match over the phone, with him threatening (bluffing really) to cancel the sale, and me daring him to (flight to Munich was already booked). Eventually his sales manager got involved and threw in a couple incentives to try and smooth things over. I won't lie, it left a bitter tasted in my mouth.

That being said, I won't be a dick and mess with his money, especially since he's proactively offering to make whatever wrong right for me in exchange for the perfect score. Aside from the near breakdown in the relationship, he recommended the tire protection package and I went with it (extra $1800), and after reading some of the threads here and elsewhere, realized after the fact that it could have been negotiated down... rookie mistake.

My question is, has anyone else ever been in that situation? Regardless of personal experience, what are some of the things that I could reasonably ask for?

Thanks.

The system is screwed up and CAs can take the blame for things other people did that they have no control over. I'm a firm believer in giving the 10s unless the CA gave a reason not to. Your CA certainly gave you a reason not to give 10s and in your situation I would not. I would be inclined to give 0s or 1s. He needs to learn how to treat people and how to be a professional.

You have the option of ignoring the survey and then it has no effect on him or anyone else and you don't have to give scores you don't really believe.

[tturedraider]

Originally Posted by AMDG

I requested one production change to add heated front seats. Aside from that, I had originally selected Bremerhaven as the drop-off location, then contacted him to find out if it were possible to switch the election to another city. He said he doubted it, but that I could contact BMW, NA directly myself and see if it was possible. These were the only changes I made, with the heated front seats being requested right after he sent me his quote, and the change in drop-off inquiry (it wasn't really a request yet) later on in the process. BMW told me the change in drop-off city wasn't a problem, I had up to 7 days before drop-off to change the drop off location, so that wasn't even an issue.

Neither requests were material to the breakdown, and neither required any additional effort or work on his behalf, but more on that in a second. The breakdown came after he suggested I check with BMW Financial services to see if I could get a better interest rate on my loan offer. My offer letter was about to expire and having already extended it once before (the first was probably way too early to be useful, but I wanted to see what I could qualify for and at what rate), I didn't want to have yet another 'hard inquiry' on my credit file.

He had assured me that since the dealership used the same bank as which had quoted me, there would not be a new inquiry into my credit, they'd use the same information the bank had pulled and present me a quote. It was all nonsense of course, but I didn't realize it at the time. Not only did their finance department submit an inquiry with the bank we both use, but also another lender, which I expressly did not authorize. The two hits dropped my credit score 6 points. Perhaps not a big deal, but I'm a stickler for honesty/fair representations.

While I wouldn't say that he deliberately lied to me about what would happen, and I was willing to chalk it up as a him being mistaken as to the process... he took an ultra-defensive position, and tried to argue that he was already doing so much, putting in so much hours and effort into this transaction and barely making any money on the sale. He even stated that it was not worth his while (which is when he threatened to cancel) and pretty much made it seem like he was losing money on the deal and doing me a favor. He even went so far as to accuse me of "being a lawyer" about things.

His supervisor called me later that even and apologized... as did he the next day, but honestly it did little to erase the bad taste in my mouth. He promised to take care of me whenever I come in for service etc. But frankly, I can't take him at his word... that's just my nature, and certainly by training, but also has to do with my past experience with him. One other thing, he tried to have me add the car to my existing insurance policy the day I signed the sale agreement... which didn't seem to make any sense since I wouldn't have the car for at least another six weeks. I confirmed as much with my insurance company... which didn't prove him a liar, but demonstrated that he really wasn't that experienced or knowledgeable about the ED process.

Probably way too much info... but that's really the sum of it, nothing material was left out the first time, and nothing else has been omitted here.

This doesn't much change my previous post, but it does make me wonder if you are aware of how dealers are compensated on ED sales. On ED sales the ONLY profit the dealer makes is the difference between ED invoice and the sales price. There is no back-end money. That money is where the ED discount came from. A thin ED deal is a very thin deal all the way around.

[bimmercar]

Originally Posted by __

The system is screwed up and CAs can take the blame for things other people did that they have no control over. I'm a firm believer in giving the 10s unless the CA gave a reason not to. Your CA certainly gave you a reason not to give 10s and in your situation I would not. I would be inclined to give 0s or 1s. He needs to learn how to treat people and how to be a professional.

You have the option of ignoring the survey and then it has no effect on him or anyone else and you don't have to give scores you don't really believe.

so what happens if you ignore the survey?

i responded one month later to my survey and it said it "expired"

[R12ax7]

I'm actually in a somewhat similar situation with the difference being this is the fourth car I've gotten from my CA. I'm debating letting him slide more out of loyalty and the fact that he did give me a pretty good deal - and I will still see him around (the fact that there was a ding in the car I didnt notice and I believe thats why I got such a good deal is something I have no way to prove).

In your case it sounds like there is no reason you should be indebted to this guy and the main reason you are even debating your response to the survey is because he asked you for all 10s - it seems to me that he may have only been proactive because he knows you may have good reason to NOT give him all 10s. That being said, I would still feel a little guilty in your position also.

Maybe the bigger question is, what does BMWNA and/or your dealer do for you if you answer honestly? Are they really going to care or offer you any incentive? Maybe I am cynical, but I feel like these kind of issues arent likely to cause anyone to come down hard on your CA nor get you much more than a free oil change (yes, I know, that was the joke i was going for).

I think goj has a good point, might as well wait til you take re-delivery.

[tturedraider]

I don't really understand why the OP got a survey in the first place. ED deals do not normally get a survey, because they are outside the regular sales process and there is no CSI money involved.

[435MSport6Speed]

I would suggest your finance questions should have been asked directly to a Business Manager. They typically know their area cold.

It also sounds like your expectation of a car salesman is too high.

I bought a Mazda last October and the experience was brutal. I still shake my head over what happened and what was said to me. I am never, ever going back to that dealership so I roasted them on every survey that came my way in great detail.

If you are never going back to this dealer, I would suggest doing the same. If you are going back and desire to have some relationship with them (service), I would suggest thinking twice before responding - maybe not responding at all.

Good luck with your decision.

[ji99lypuff]

Im a firm believer in giving out scores that represent actual service. If not then how will they ever get better. But like many others have mentioned i think we buyers expect too much quality or care from a salesman in this day and age.(crazy right?) Its just a job to them at the end of the day. I too had a terrible experience buyin my bmw and i was being as nice and chill as i could at the dealer. I guess they thought they could take advantage of my kindness or whatever and get away with subpar service. I told them that o was not satisfied with their service and i never received a survey from them. I didnt even have a chance to fill out thekr score card. Its easy to tell if the owner of the dealership is there busting balls or not. I think most dealers have absentee owners who let managers take care of the business and service gets lost through the cracks without your boss constabtly dogging you to work harder. Boooo to the whole dealership buying experience.

[AMDG]

Originally Posted by __

This doesn't much change my previous post, but it does make me wonder if you are aware of how dealers are compensated on ED sales. On ED sales the ONLY profit the dealer makes is the difference between ED invoice and the sales price. There is no back-end money. That money is where the ED discount came from. A thin ED deal is a very thin deal all the way around.

I'm not sure what prompted the question about whether I know how dealers are compensated... and not at all trying to be rude, but frankly I don't care. I only accepted what he quoted, which in fairness to him was lower than what everyone else was offering. They're not in it for charity, so obviously there was some benefit to them doing the transaction. For that reason I didn't care for him griping to me about how much work he had to do... not my concern. I could see if I were being unreasonable, and a pain in the ass... which I wasn't. Those two additional changes were all that was requested. He pushed the financing through BMW, I declined the first time a month earlier when my original offer letter was about to expire, took him up this time. Maybe there's some incentive there for him steering customers to BMW Financial Services...

Bottomline is that his attitude sucked... and then he apologized for it.

[AMDG]

Originally Posted by R12ax7

I'm actually in a somewhat similar situation with the difference being this is the fourth car I've gotten from my CA. I'm debating letting him slide more out of loyalty and the fact that he did give me a pretty good deal - and I will still see him around (the fact that there was a ding in the car I didnt notice and I believe thats why I got such a good deal is something I have no way to prove).

In your case it sounds like there is no reason you should be indebted to this guy and the main reason you are even debating your response to the survey is because he asked you for all 10s - it seems to me that he may have only been proactive because he knows you may have good reason to NOT give him all 10s. That being said, I would still feel a little guilty in your position also.

Maybe the bigger question is, what does BMWNA and/or your dealer do for you if you answer honestly? Are they really going to care or offer you any incentive? Maybe I am cynical, but I feel like these kind of issues arent likely to cause anyone to come down hard on your CA nor get you much more than a free oil change (yes, I know, that was the joke i was going for).

I think goj has a good point, might as well wait til you take re-delivery.

This pretty much sums up my feelings. I'm at the point where if we both could make some lemonade out of this situation, he with his bonus, and me with something worth my while, I'm willing to let it slide. But I do accept what others have said about that not being fair to other SAs.

[AMDG]

Originally Posted by paulff3

I would suggest your finance questions should have been asked directly to a Business Manager. They typically know their area cold.

It also sounds like your expectation of a car salesman is too high.

I bought a Mazda last October and the experience was brutal. I still shake my head over what happened and what was said to me. I am never, ever going back to that dealership so I roasted them on every survey that came my way in great detail.

If you are never going back to this dealer, I would suggest doing the same. If you are going back and desire to have some relationship with them (service), I would suggest thinking twice before responding - maybe not responding at all.

Good luck with your decision.

I just expect him to be straight up with me... no different from my trash collector, client, judge, police officer, school teacher...

[435MSport6Speed]

Originally Posted by AMDG

I just expect him to be straight up with me... no different from my trash collector, client, judge, police officer, school teacher...

Not really the point I was making but even so, expecting a car salesman to be "straight up" with you is expecting too much. They are trying to sell you a car, nothing more, nothing less.

I was referring to expecting the salesman to know the ins and outs of the financing process, credit checks etc.... I'm surprised if they know the features of the car.

There is a reason they run back and forth to the managers during the negotiation process. They are the lowest rung in the ladder at a dealership.

[R12ax7]

Woops, accidental double post

I'm actually in a somewhat similar situation with the difference being this is the fourth car I've gotten from my CA. I'm debating letting him slide more out of loyalty and the fact that he did give me a pretty good deal - and I will still see him around (the fact that there was a ding in the car I didnt notice and I believe thats why I got such a good deal is something I have no way to prove).

In your case it sounds like there is no reason you should be indebted to this guy and the main reason you are even debating your response to the survey is because he asked you for all 10s - it seems to me that he may have only been proactive because he knows you may have good reason to NOT give him all 10s. That being said, I would still feel a little guilty in your position also.

Maybe the bigger question is, what does BMWNA and/or your dealer do for you if you answer honestly? Are they really going to care or offer you any incentive? Maybe I am cynical, but I feel like these kind of issues arent likely to cause anyone to come down hard on your CA nor get you much more than a free oil change (yes, I know, that was the joke i was going for).

I think goj has a good point, might as well wait til you take re-delivery.

[R12ax7]

Originally Posted by ji99lypuff

Im a firm believer in giving out scores that represent actual service. If not then how will they ever get better. But like many others have mentioned i think we buyers expect too much quality or care from a salesman in this day and age.(crazy right?) Its just a job to them at the end of the day. I too had a terrible experience buyin my bmw and i was being as nice and chill as i could at the dealer. I guess they thought they could take advantage of my kindness or whatever and get away with subpar service. I told them that o was not satisfied with their service and i never received a survey from them. I didnt even have a chance to fill out thekr score card. Its easy to tell if the owner of the dealership is there busting balls or not. I think most dealers have absentee owners who let managers take care of the business and service gets lost through the cracks without your boss constabtly dogging you to work harder. Boooo to the whole dealership buying experience.

This ... I am sure I am not the only one here who feels like they have to educate the CA on the car the CA is supposedly "selling" me. I guess it just comes with the territory. They arent looking out for the customer, they are just trying to make a sale - but it sounds like this guy was unprofessional and unhelpful and his manager should know.

[UNC2016]

I bought my car 2 months ago. Fortunately all went well. My CA also asked that I give him all 10's when the survey came. In fact, he discussed it with me on 2 other occasions on the day of the sale and sent me a follow up email with the same request. These guys must be under tremendous pressure to score all 10's to keep their jobs.

[Beek]

Having worked at a dealership in Parts for thirteen years I know more than the Sales department can take a hit from these surveys. Several time's the owner where I worked called a company meeting and announced our rating was at 8.98 or something and the manufacturer had told him they would give him a thousand dollars per car sold for the year if we could get that up to 9.1, if we helped do it he would split half that amount with the troops. I got several nice bonus checks that way.

So personally I would give them the tens but I would definitely let them know what their real score should have been or as others have said, skip the survey altogether.

[eluded]

Judges scores 10,10,4,10