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09-13-2020, 03:56 PM | #1 |
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Is the auto industry going to start increaszing cylinder count?
There are now more I4 (and some I3) engines in BMWs than ever before. Fewer I6s to choose from. Will things ever go back to more I6?
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09-13-2020, 04:40 PM | #2 |
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I still cry daily over the loss of V12s in F1. Basically every thing gets worse over time.
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09-13-2020, 05:21 PM | #3 |
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09-13-2020, 06:27 PM | #5 |
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This is all due to greenhouse gas emissions and fuel economy standards. Believe me car manufacturers are forced to downsize engines to meet these standards.
The future looks pretty bleak for the internal combustion engine and electrification is taking over already. |
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09-13-2020, 07:46 PM | #6 |
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Technology allows fantastic performance from 4CYL engines now, so no need for the extra cost/mass of the larger engines. The good news is that as long as manufacturers can keep meeting the ULEV standards with large displacement/more cylinder engines, they will keep producing them because of people like us that pay the money.
I just want a manual option back, screw the 10ths the auto is faster, it's stupid to not have a manual option in every driver's car. |
09-13-2020, 08:07 PM | #8 |
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09-13-2020, 08:56 PM | #9 |
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Due to EU7, the head of Porsche Motorsport believes the answer is “yes”.
https://www.whichcar.com.au/news/big...coming-for-911 “I expect 20 percent more displacement on average for these EU7-capable engines. Many manufacturers will jump from four to six, or from six to eight [cylinders].“ |
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09-13-2020, 09:48 PM | #10 | |
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I must say the first time I thought about this was with the B57 quad turbo vs the SQ7 V8 engine as well as what Cummins are doing with the X15 class 8 truck engine and the various versions they make of that where it is derated down to levels a 12 or 13 litre engine can operate at, but they claim better efficiency.
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09-13-2020, 11:39 PM | #11 | |
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I mean, what do people want, torque-less engines that have to rev up to 8000 rpm? Those can be fun, but the world moved on. BMW went to turbos a long time ago for their max performance stuff. People want torque and power now, not at 6000rpm, so modern turbos are great for this. They also don't need to go 170mph in every car, so 260lb is plenty, especially if it is always on tap. Now you have electric motors that can kick in. Either to boost the engine output, or spin the turbo, or as a supercharger. What would increasing cylinder count get you? The only reason is to increase displacement if you need more tuning potential, say for a high performance variant. Don't say reliability. Manufacturers care about selling cars, not 10-year reliability. It's someone else's problem if it grenades down the road and the people that keep the gravy train going for the manufacturers keep buying them.
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09-14-2020, 01:54 AM | #12 | |
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09-14-2020, 05:23 AM | #14 | |
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A manual transmission can be set to "comfort", "sport", and "track" modes simply by the technique and speed at which you shift it; it doesn't need "modes", modes are for manumatics that try to behave like a real 3-pedal manual transmission. If you can money-shift it, it's a manual transmission. "Yeah, but NO ONE puts an automatic trans shift knob on a manual transmission."
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09-14-2020, 06:32 AM | #15 |
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No.
The reasons are political of which science is used as justification.
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09-14-2020, 06:48 AM | #16 | |
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“This new regulation is really difficult to fulfil because we will have different cold start emissions side and bigger catalytic converters. When I'm talking bigger, I'm talking a factor of three to four times more, so there will be a small chemical industrial factory in the car to really control this," he says. Packaging is going to be an issue and automakers want to be able to sell powertrains world wide so that means engines which are compliant in more than one market.
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09-14-2020, 08:00 AM | #17 | |||
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Quite possible. At any rate, I've been aware of this interview since it was first published in May.
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Quote:
That aside, the fact is that BMW has dozens of I6 *40i and M*40i models, plus *30d, 40d, and M*40d models, and now *45e PHEVs. And they are planning to start adding new M*45 (or perhaps M*50e) I6 performance hybrids soon. In fact, BMW has more I6 powered models now than ever, although that's due largely to the fact that they have so many (too many, really) models in the lineup. Still, the I6 is alive and well at BMW in applications that require more power than an I4 could comfortably achieve. Quote:
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09-14-2020, 11:29 AM | #18 |
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Seems like a lot of manufactures are looking at new I6s. Mercedes released the M256 a couple years ago after not having an I6 for two decades. Mazda is releasing their I6 next year, FCA is working on the Tornado I6 for their performance cars. Gives me a little hope!
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09-14-2020, 01:14 PM | #19 | |
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With the exception of Mazda's, these new I6 engines are replacing legacy V6 families, typically boasting less displacement, not more. They are making a comeback because they have more in common with I4 engines than V6s do, so in the long term they will be more economical. This is indeed great news, but I would not expect to see any of these used in applications where a turbocharged I4 is used today. The possible wild-card here is the Mazda SkyActive I6 which is rumored to have a naturally aspirated variant, assuming it ever sees the light of day. |
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09-14-2020, 01:33 PM | #20 |
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I'm not optimistic. Smaller motors and now electric motors are putting out power that larger displacement motors from 10-15 years ago could only dream of. For mass market appeal, no one is going to want a large displacement v8 anymore when you can get the same or better performance with far higher efficiency for a hybrid 4. Maybe we'll see some small displacement 6 and 8 cylinders, but those can be costly to produce. Hell, even the C63 is suppose to get a hybrid 4.
I think we'll see far more hybrids as automakers move to electrification. |
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09-14-2020, 01:42 PM | #21 | |
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09-14-2020, 02:02 PM | #22 |
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The new Lexus IS will have a BMW i6.
It will be interesting to see how much of a come back the i6 makes and whether the i3 quad turbo is abandoned. Wonder if we'll see more hybrid i6's. |
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