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      10-17-2020, 09:16 AM   #111
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https://electrek.co/2020/10/16/tesla...return-policy/
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      10-23-2020, 08:42 PM   #112
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Tesla also chopped it's 4 year used car warranty to 1 year - they're turning into an actual autos company!
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I thought the next M4 was going to be a flying car powered by bloomin' onions and a teaspoon of mayonnaise. At least that's what I read on the internet @ BimmerPoop.org.
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      10-24-2020, 04:12 PM   #113
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https://insideevs.com/news/450511/te...ension-issues/

riding inside my mates 3 years old model s is like sitting inside a rickety old box. most noise coming from the rear.
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      10-24-2020, 04:26 PM   #114
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https://insideevs.com/news/450511/te...ension-issues/

riding inside my mates 3 years old model s is like sitting inside a rickety old box. most noise coming from the rear.
I think itís universally understood build quality is lackluster. But the fanbois donít care, so itís all good.
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      10-24-2020, 04:44 PM   #115
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https://insideevs.com/news/450511/te...ension-issues/

riding inside my mates 3 years old model s is like sitting inside a rickety old box. most noise coming from the rear.

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I think it’s universally understood build quality is lackluster. But the fanbois don’t care, so it’s all good.
While there is definitely tesla fanbois who will praise the company no matter what they do I also feel there are plenty of haters who will hate on the company no matter what they do.

When I got my model 3 (used 2018) I was totally expecting a complete disaster. I had 7 days to return it and was bored during lockdowns so said fuck it lets see. I was surprised just how.... normal... it was. Nothing blatantly obvious with build quality, all the materials seemed like nice quality, there isn't much in the interior, but the materials that are there are on par or better quality than your average 3 series. I personally find the white pleather really nice, better than the pleather BMW was putting in their cars when I had my 1 series. That shit was like rubber.

My car has no rattles and everything feels nice and tight. That being said I don't think I have ever had a car (including BMWs) that didn't have a rattle, somewhere at some point. Now if you are anal retentive I'm sure you will notice some of the body panel gaps are larger than they should, some are not 100% even, but nothing any normal person would notice.

Plus Tesla has been doing this for what... like 12 years? How long have the other manufacturers been at this... a century? Now if you want to talk about Tesla service or their buying experience or their software policies.... then I'm all in favor of calling them out on that!
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      10-24-2020, 05:00 PM   #116
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https://insideevs.com/news/450511/te...ension-issues/

riding inside my mates 3 years old model s is like sitting inside a rickety old box. most noise coming from the rear.

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Originally Posted by P1 View Post
I think it's universally understood build quality is lackluster. But the fanbois don't care, so it's all good.
While there is definitely tesla fanbois who will praise the company no matter what they do I also feel there are plenty of haters who will hate on the company no matter what they do.

When I got my model 3 (used 2018) I was totally expecting a complete disaster. I had 7 days to return it and was bored during lockdowns so said fuck it lets see. I was surprised just how.... normal... it was. Nothing blatantly obvious with build quality, all the materials seemed like nice quality, there isn't much in the interior, but the materials that are there are on par or better quality than your average 3 series. I personally find the white pleather really nice, better than the pleather BMW was putting in their cars when I had my 1 series. That shit was like rubber.

My car has no rattles and everything feels nice and tight. That being said I don't think I have ever had a car (including BMWs) that didn't have a rattle, somewhere at some point. Now if you are anal retentive I'm sure you will notice some of the body panel gaps are larger than they should, some are not 100% even, but nothing any normal person would notice.

Plus Tesla has been doing this for what... like 12 years? How long have the other manufacturers been at this... a century? Now if you want to talk about Tesla service or their buying experience or their software policies.... then I'm all in favor of calling them out on that!

Good for you for the price they charge it better be rattle free for you.
my mates model s was £79000. sitting inside it was no different from vauxhall and citroen taxis bar the vegan leather and acceleration.
For similar money one could do so much better...
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      10-24-2020, 05:27 PM   #117
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Good for you for the price they charge it better be rattle free for you.
my mates model s was £79000. sitting inside it was no different from vauxhall and citroen taxis bar the vegan leather and acceleration.
For similar money one could do so much better...
For what they charge? A base model 3 costs less than a base 3 series. Even a long range AWD model 3 is the same price as an AWD model 3, but the model 3 does 0-60 in 4.2 sec the BMW in 5.3...

Well I guess you can get an M3 that would get you to 4.4 sec 0-60 but at a cost of $54,700 which then puts you at the price of a model 3 performance... 3.1 sec 0-60... which is now super car numbers.... for $55k.

Then again maybe shit is different over there.
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      10-24-2020, 06:53 PM   #118
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Good for you for the price they charge it better be rattle free for you.
my mates model s was £79000. sitting inside it was no different from vauxhall and citroen taxis bar the vegan leather and acceleration.
For similar money one could do so much better...
For what they charge? A base model 3 costs less than a base 3 series. Even a long range AWD model 3 is the same price as an AWD model 3, but the model 3 does 0-60 in 4.2 sec the BMW in 5.3...

Well I guess you can get an M3 that would get you to 4.4 sec 0-60 but at a cost of $54,700 which then puts you at the price of a model 3 performance... 3.1 sec 0-60... which is now super car numbers.... for $55k.

Then again maybe shit is different over there.
yesterday we were driving in my mates model s to a badminton game. he tries to show off with acceleration autopilot etc to another friend who he was trying to impress. I could hear rickety suspension noises especially fromrear (20k miles)Also tells us how he has bought shares in Tesla and 'believes in the product'
few minutes later he exclaims oh shit I have only 6 miles left. Nearest charger 12 miles away. Stops his car and mutters 'I should have calculated better.
We take a taxi home.
I vow never to set foot inside his vehicle again.
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      10-24-2020, 11:11 PM   #119
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yesterday we were driving in my mates model s to a badminton game. he tries to show off with acceleration autopilot etc to another friend who he was trying to impress. I could hear rickety suspension noises especially fromrear (20k miles)Also tells us how he has bought shares in Tesla and 'believes in the product'
few minutes later he exclaims oh shit I have only 6 miles left. Nearest charger 12 miles away. Stops his car and mutters 'I should have calculated better.
We take a taxi home.
I vow never to set foot inside his vehicle again.
Well sounds to me like your friend is just an idiot. My friend has had a model 3 for a few years, he drives it for work so it has to have 50k+ miles on it. I don't recall any noises coming from it when I visited. Mine definitely has no rattles or suspension noise but mine only has 15k miles.

As for running out of juice, again that seems to be an issue with your friend, not so much the car. I have never run out of gas and have never run out of battery on the tesla. However I'm the kind of person that starts thinking about filling up when I'm at half a tank. If I hit 1/4 tank I start getting anxiety. Plus I charge it at home so I always start the day with a full tank. I have never HAD to charge it outside my garage.
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      10-27-2020, 03:43 PM   #120
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Well sounds to me like your friend is just an idiot.
Yup, that's idiot behavior - like the people who run out of fuel despite a perfectly functional fuel gauge.

As for Tesla's product, yeah they can have quality / build issues - so do others: we just pulled the plug (get it?) on our X5 45e order for recall issues - but Tesla's have been worse ... that said, Tesla is getting better every quarter and will continue to get better. And cheaper.

Tesla just committed to $10B-$12B in new factories and those factories will have Tesla's latest proprietary designs, the quality will be much higher and the cost/unit will be much cheaper ...

... and that's what should scare the shit out of every other manufacturer.
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I thought the next M4 was going to be a flying car powered by bloomin' onions and a teaspoon of mayonnaise. At least that's what I read on the internet @ BimmerPoop.org.
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      10-27-2020, 05:23 PM   #121
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Yup, that's idiot behavior - like the people who run out of fuel despite a perfectly functional fuel gauge.

As for Tesla's product, yeah they can have quality / build issues - so do others: we just pulled the plug (get it?) on our X5 45e order for recall issues - but Tesla's have been worse ... that said, Tesla is getting better every quarter and will continue to get better. And cheaper.

Tesla just committed to $10B-$12B in new factories and those factories will have Tesla's latest proprietary designs, the quality will be much higher and the cost/unit will be much cheaper ...

... and that's what should scare the shit out of every other manufacturer.

No...

and he takes a taxi to the nearest fuel station which is like 2-3 minutes away gets fuel in a can and fills some and away he goes less than an hour.

If an idiot like my friend on bev runs out of charge then what? that's why I won't set foot into his tesla again.

I am sooo happy I bought a ICE G05 just before the mild hybrids and hybrids kicked in.
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      10-27-2020, 05:30 PM   #122
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No...

and he takes a taxi to the nearest fuel station which is like 2-3 minutes away gets fuel in a can and fills some and away he goes less than an hour.

If an idiot like my friend on bev runs out of charge then what? that's why I won't set foot into his tesla again.
Hmmmm... I dunno, get towed home, towed to nearest charger, AAA charging truck... or don't be an idiot and don't run out. In 22 years of driving I have never ran out of gas. Guess your friend is still out there.... hopelessly wondering what he can possible do.

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a1...stly-unneeded/
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      10-27-2020, 05:31 PM   #123
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and he takes a taxi to the nearest fuel station which is like 2-3 minutes away gets fuel in a can
Anyone with a working fuel gauge who runs out of fuel 2-3 minutes away from a fuel station should be avoided at all costs - they're too dumb for life.

I mean most of us live in houses powered by electricity and realize if we don't pay the bill the power goes out.

Competently managing resources is kind of a life skill.
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I thought the next M4 was going to be a flying car powered by bloomin' onions and a teaspoon of mayonnaise. At least that's what I read on the internet @ BimmerPoop.org.
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      10-27-2020, 07:25 PM   #124
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Hmmmm... I dunno, get towed home, towed to nearest charger, AAA charging truck... or don't be an idiot and don't run out. In 22 years of driving I have never ran out of gas. Guess your friend is still out there.... hopelessly wondering what he can possible do.

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a1...stly-unneeded/
the article is from 2016 ...here's an article from 2019. Won't be surprised if he doesn't have breakdown cover though..
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      10-27-2020, 07:56 PM   #125
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I have been looking at Tesla's for awhile but decided not to get one this time. Instead I bought a Toyota Prius Prime plug in hybrid instead for $22,000 after rebates. I liked the 660 miles of range and the ability to run it in EV mode for 28 miles. That allowed me to keep my BMW 440IX 6MT for now. I wanted a spare cheaper city car to run errands and not worry about. So far I am really impressed and this is after looking at the Tesla 3 which is a also a great car. Tesla are pushing the industry forward more than anyone.
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      10-28-2020, 05:31 AM   #126
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Originally Posted by dreamingat30fps View Post
Hmmmm... I dunno, get towed home, towed to nearest charger, AAA charging truck... or don't be an idiot and don't run out. In 22 years of driving I have never ran out of gas. Guess your friend is still out there.... hopelessly wondering what he can possible do.

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a1...stly-unneeded/
That's because in most areas of the US, depending on population density, there is a gas station every few miles, you can pay with two forms of currency, and the recovery time is 5 minutes.
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      10-28-2020, 05:36 AM   #127
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Anyone with a working fuel gauge who runs out of fuel 2-3 minutes away from a fuel station should be avoided at all costs - they're too dumb for life.

I mean most of us live in houses powered by electricity and realize if we don't pay the bill the power goes out.

Competently managing resources is kind of a life skill.
Wait, you mean we know what happens if we don't pay the monthly bill for the solar electric system installed on our house, right?
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      10-28-2020, 05:38 AM   #128
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Actually, what does happen? Does the solar company come and repossess it?
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      10-28-2020, 06:26 AM   #129
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Wait, you mean we know what happens if we don't pay the monthly bill for the solar electric system installed on our house, right?
I don't have a solar system ... or even a house!

But soon that'll be no problem as the energy startups are j-curving seeing the energy deregulation boom coming - everybody (who understands the future) wants to be the AT&T or Verizon of power. Startups like Solstice are going after deregulation in a big way by installing community systems that people can subscribe to with no up-front costs or having their own rooftop solar system.

And pro tip: the notion energy deregulation and renewable energy is a blue-vs-red thing is complete crap - the hilarious part are the investors publicly preaching oil & gas but privately investing in renewables. As an example, as of July 2020, TX, OK, and IA generated more wind & solar electricity on a trailing-12-month basis than all 20 blue states combined. Texas is smart - they're simply transitioning from oil to wind and solar before anyone realizes TX won and they lost the race. it's a core reason Tesla looked at TX & OK for their new plant and I wouldn't be surprised to seem them spend some of their new $12B in OK.

For some people energy deregulation has been happening for 10 years, but for many others it'll seem like suddenly it's dumb not to subscribe to a community energy service (which will be solar/wind based). And, of course, once you're already generating your own electricity off your roof and/or community system, why pay for another form of energy, gasoline?

Just like cell phones killed landlines and streaming is killing cable, energy deregulation will kill consumer oil & gas - Texas figured it out 5 years ago.
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I thought the next M4 was going to be a flying car powered by bloomin' onions and a teaspoon of mayonnaise. At least that's what I read on the internet @ BimmerPoop.org.

Last edited by GrussGott; 10-28-2020 at 06:43 AM..
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      10-28-2020, 09:32 AM   #130
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I don't have a solar system ... or even a house!

But soon that'll be no problem as the energy startups are j-curving seeing the energy deregulation boom coming - everybody (who understands the future) wants to be the AT&T or Verizon of power. Startups like Solstice are going after deregulation in a big way by installing community systems that people can subscribe to with no up-front costs or having their own rooftop solar system.

And pro tip: the notion energy deregulation and renewable energy is a blue-vs-red thing is complete crap - the hilarious part are the investors publicly preaching oil & gas but privately investing in renewables. As an example, as of July 2020, TX, OK, and IA generated more wind & solar electricity on a trailing-12-month basis than all 20 blue states combined. Texas is smart - they're simply transitioning from oil to wind and solar before anyone realizes TX won and they lost the race. it's a core reason Tesla looked at TX & OK for their new plant and I wouldn't be surprised to seem them spend some of their new $12B in OK.

For some people energy deregulation has been happening for 10 years, but for many others it'll seem like suddenly it's dumb not to subscribe to a community energy service (which will be solar/wind based). And, of course, once you're already generating your own electricity off your roof and/or community system, why pay for another form of energy, gasoline?

Just like cell phones killed landlines and streaming is killing cable, energy deregulation will kill consumer oil & gas - Texas figured it out 5 years ago.
I'm in a community energy service already; It uses coal, nat gas, wind, and nuke. Oil is less than 1% of electrical energy production in the US. Not sure how solar will kill consumer oil for electricity production.
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      10-28-2020, 02:40 PM   #131
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I'm in a community energy service already; It uses coal, nat gas, wind, and nuke. Oil is less than 1% of electrical energy production in the US. Not sure how solar will kill consumer oil for electricity production.
Go back and read the post, but basically solar is at the point of being cheaper than coal, nuke, and gas and that cost disparity is only going to increase (plus it's mobile, local, and easy to install!). For example, Tesla mega-pack peaker plants already cost 10% of the equivalent gas-fired peakers, and this is all before you start throwing in bi-directional charging and V2G tech which could be so lucrative as to offset the cost of the family car.

Gasoline has a loooonnngggg, expensive, messy, fragile, resource-heavy supply chain that has to be updated at 1000s of locations weekly. If a family can buy a household megapack, get outage/storm protection, offset their electricity costs - and then add an electric car that also gets a V2G kickback, uses the power they generate, and eliminates a trip to the gas station and any gasoline supply chain problems thus making them self-sufficient ... they'd be stupid not to do it. And they will ... they're already starting.

And once people start buying less gasoline (which they are now if only due to covid), that long, messy, expensive, fragile gasoline supply chain is going to get very expensive and soon there'll be a tidal wave of people moving away from petrol.

So it's energy deregulation and local renewable microgeneration that will slowly strangle the consumer oil/petrol market (which requires massive scale to be remotely feasible). I'm sure you know how an economic flywheel works - so that's how.
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I thought the next M4 was going to be a flying car powered by bloomin' onions and a teaspoon of mayonnaise. At least that's what I read on the internet @ BimmerPoop.org.

Last edited by GrussGott; 10-28-2020 at 03:02 PM..
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      10-28-2020, 10:01 PM   #132
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Go back and read the post, but basically solar is at the point of being cheaper than coal, nuke, and gas and that cost disparity is only going to increase (plus it's mobile, local, and easy to install!). For example, Tesla mega-pack peaker plants already cost 10% of the equivalent gas-fired peakers, and this is all before you start throwing in bi-directional charging and V2G tech which could be so lucrative as to offset the cost of the family car.

Gasoline has a loooonnngggg, expensive, messy, fragile, resource-heavy supply chain that has to be updated at 1000s of locations weekly. If a family can buy a household megapack, get outage/storm protection, offset their electricity costs - and then add an electric car that also gets a V2G kickback, uses the power they generate, and eliminates a trip to the gas station and any gasoline supply chain problems thus making them self-sufficient ... they'd be stupid not to do it. And they will ... they're already starting.

And once people start buying less gasoline (which they are now if only due to covid), that long, messy, expensive, fragile gasoline supply chain is going to get very expensive and soon there'll be a tidal wave of people moving away from petrol.

So it's energy deregulation and local renewable microgeneration that will slowly strangle the consumer oil/petrol market (which requires massive scale to be remotely feasible). I'm sure you know how an economic flywheel works - so that's how.
Last time I checked, gasoline works at night too.
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