why dealing with car salesmen is so frustrating ?

Mosaud1998 · 10-28-2021, 04:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shipill

I'm very sorry I dont mean to hurt your feeling but nobody likes a car salesman!

I'm chilling buddy

BMW41049 · 10-28-2021, 04:51 PM

Our car salesman at our local BMW dealer was very cool. We bought two cars from him and were pretty happy with our deal. I've met some scamming lying dirtbags over the years and he was not in this category. The so called Genius however was useless and was anything but a Genius.

upstatedoc · 10-28-2021, 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shipill

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mosaud1998

Could've been an automated email.

I'm a salesman and the majority of my customers enjoy working with me. Maybe because I'm not pushy? Idk

I'm very sorry I dont mean to hurt your feeling but nobody likes a car salesman!

I've had a few car salesman that I've liked over the years. Mostly the Acura guys. You created a thread looking for advice/input, why not take it constructively?

Our03z4 · 10-28-2021, 04:59 PM

This is one of the many reasons I ordered my newest car online. No haggling or games. It showed up on time and I had a PPI done that came back perfect. All in all A+ experience. Didn't have time to go to a dealer this time but it's never fun. Last truck I bought I was in and out in about 30mins, helped the dealer was about to close, I knew exactly what I wanted and they were a no haggle Ford dealer. (This is how all dealers should be)

lsturbointeg · 11-03-2021, 09:03 AM

when i bought my Porsche the SA was very helpful and did everything i wanted him to do. This was by far the simplest transaction ever! i had more headaches buying my Honda Civic LOL!

chassis · 11-03-2021, 11:12 AM

Commission based compensation. It’s the agency problem.

dreamingat30fps · 11-03-2021, 11:26 AM

I have had very easy experiences for at LEAST the last 3-4 cars I've bought. I usually try to do 90% of everything online. My truck I found online at a dealer several hours away. I researched the dealer and they seemed to have a very good reputation. Did the whole deal over email even my trade and just drove there to pick it up.

The model 3 was from Carvana, not the best deal but completely hassle free. The mustang and the corolla (that I sold a few months ago for more than I paid) were from no haggle dealers in and out.

Now I will say I was helping my mom get a corolla (before I bought mine) and she lives in Miami. I have a rule that I NEVER go to dealers south of me and NEVER NO MATTER WHAT go to dealers in Miami. They are the worst of the worst the scummiest scumbags you will find (and they always advertise ridiculously low prices online). Anyways we picked her up and were headed north from Miami, but she decided to stop at a Toyota dealer halfway that supposedly had the car she wanted and had a good price online.....

OMFG what a shit show. I won't go into the whole thing, but obviously the deal they told her was fake and I have 0 patience with these guys. I would just walk out instantly, but my mom is trying to be nice to this scumbag pos. Eventually I get her to leave with me and this fucking guy literally follows us to the car yelling and screaming that she will not get a better deal anywhere. I asked the guy if he wanted to get in the trunk and come with us. Most ridiculous experience I've ever had.

Needless to say we drove to a no haggle dealer north of me and she got the exact car she wanted for a better deal with 0 drama. I later ended up getting my corolla from that same dealer hassle free.

Higgs Boson · 11-03-2021, 01:08 PM

The customer starts the haggle and hassle in the process the minute they ask for a discount. If everyone who searched online and called on the car they wanted just paid the online price the process would sure go a lot smoother and have no back and forth would it not? If you don't want to negotiate on a car then don't. The salesperson doesn't want to either. Pay it or just quietly go buy something somewhere else.

But really, how many of you could adjust to and accept that process? Almost none. You'd rather try to work a discount and then complain.

Tesla 2020 sales were under 500k units
Ford 2 million
GM 6.8 million
FCA 2 million
etc

Tesla sells a fraction of what the other domestic brands sell and they do indeed have dealerships and service departments also. So really, your issue is with the franchising aspect of the retail location. The manufacturers make their money as soon as they wholesale the car to the dealer. After that, it's the dealer's problem.

What about preowned auto sales? Teslas get sold used all the time. They aren't franchise stores, just completely independent operations. Some good, some bad.

dreamingat30fps · 11-03-2021, 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Higgs Boson

The customer starts the haggle and hassle in the process the minute they ask for a discount. If everyone who searched online and called on the car they wanted just paid the online price the process would sure go a lot smoother and have no back and forth would it not? If you don't want to negotiate on a car then don't. The salesperson doesn't want to either. Pay it or just quietly go buy something somewhere else.

But really, how many of you could adjust to and accept that process? Almost none. You'd rather try to work a discount and then complain.

Tesla 2020 sales were under 500k units
Ford 2 million
GM 6.8 million
FCA 2 million
etc

Tesla sells a fraction of what the other domestic brands sell and they do indeed have dealerships and service departments also. So really, your issue is with the franchising aspect of the retail location. The manufacturers make their money as soon as they wholesale the car to the dealer. After that, it's the dealer's problem.

What about preowned auto sales? Teslas get sold used all the time. They aren't franchise stores, just completely independent operations. Some good, some bad.

BS come down to Miami and try to get any of the advertised online prices.

Germanauto · 11-03-2021, 03:34 PM

Car buying sucks. The overwhelming majority of car salespeople I've come across are varying degrees of unknowledgeable, pushy, or arrogrant. I can count on one hand how many fair and professional salespeople i've come across.

OP I also hate when they try to lure you into the dealer. We live in a digital world, I always do my research and run my numbers online then reach out via email. They send some numbers, I counter with Leasehacker, etc. That's how it's supposed to work now. Only reason one should have to visit the showroom is the see and drive the car.

Every now and then you come across a guy who is persistent (in a good way) and wants to cut a fair deal after some back-and-forth. No bs, not overly pushy, they're just straight with you. Hats off to those guys.

Bunnny · 11-03-2021, 09:00 PM

When I got my M4 from a luxury dealership, and walked into the salesman's office I noticed a billion tabs open about BMW's...
He knew fuck all about anything to do with the car, and that was fine because I knew what I wanted and I did my research wayyyy before hand.
Car was listed as "lava red" (sakhir orange), and you all should've seen this guy's face when this small woman told him that color doesn't actually exist.

Priceless.

vreihen16 · 11-04-2021, 08:32 AM

When my wife bought her EV, the dealer's finance/closing guy tried to sell her a pre-paid oil change plan. I think that it was an honest mistake out of habit, since it was the first EV that they ever sold.

The sales guy even admitted to watching all of the YouTube videos on the car the night before she picked it up, because he was obligated to provide an overview of everything at delivery and likewise had never seen an EV before.

Whenever she goes to the dealership now, a small crowd of sales/parts/service people swarm her to look at the car and ask questions.....

bmwlover0725 · 11-04-2021, 08:40 AM

I could explain everything about why and how things operate at dealerships because my career is traveling to them throughout the country and training them, but I’ll spare you lol. Unfortunately, the car buying process sucks and there isn’t any end in sight for that (not for a while anyway). Your best bet is to go into the dealership in person. Tell them you don’t want any bullshit and as soon as they start (because they will), kindly remind them and ask to speak with a sales manager if you’ve had it. I know it sounds overly rude to do, but they aren’t there for your best interest. Just explain that you’re serious but you won’t be doing business with them if they play games. Just one thing to remember, they are there to make some kind of profit. It’s okay to negotiate, but I’ve always tried to avoid being the one guy of the month who basically steals something and isn’t welcome to show their face there again because of it. Good luck with the purchase and enjoy whatever you buy!

Alfisti · 11-04-2021, 09:04 AM

Who's stealing anything in this climate? Lucky if you get out with a reasonable price let alone a deal.

TheWatchGuy · 11-04-2021, 09:06 AM

with how easily it is to search for cars online, id bet 99% of emails dealers get about cars are from people that arent buying. Its not effective to treat every email as a potential buyer, which is why they want you in the dealership, because at that point, at least you have put some effort into the car and have some time invested as well.

as to going to factory reps over dealerships and thinking youll get a better experience, LOL. the only thing that will be better is youll know the price you are paying before you walk in because they have no incentive to haggle. Those reps are still going to be paid commission, and will still push you to buy. Its just cutting out the local dealer aspect of it and replacing it with a national "dealer" basically.

and if you are buying a car and wanting the salesperson to teach you about the car, youre already losing. car brands have what, 20+ models/trims/options/etc. its unrealistic to think they will know everything about the cars other than highlights.

my things that have always worked for me when buying a car are I know everything about the car and the market for the car going in to the process and i have a max amount I'm willing to spend based on the market. I also am willing to travel, sometimes out of state, for the car I want and make that known early on in the process. If they dont want to match the price, I get that up front so Im not wasting my time or their time.

///d · 11-08-2021, 11:42 PM

Car salesman hate me. It's rare that I find one that knows more about a vehicle than I do and I'm not afraid to call them out when they try to bullshit me or anyone else on options/packages/service etc. I had a BMW salesman try to sell me a X5 M Sport saying it had M Adaptive because it's an M Sport and all M Sport have M Adaptive. I had to show him otherwise on the build sheet. He also tried to tell me that the 35d did not come with Drivers Assist Plus.

Years ago I noticed an Audi that caught my eye at a local used car dealership. I was driving my 91 Yota beater truck that day. I was the only customer there at the time, I pulled in, noticed the guys inside watch me drive by the window, parked by the Audi, got out, walked around checking it out for a good 5 minutes, waited, walked around some other vehicles, one of the guys walked out and said he would be with me in a minute so I went back to the Audi, waited again. No one came out but I could see them inside just jaw-jacking over coffee and kept casually glancing over to see if I was there, so I left. Few days later for shits and giggles I went back in the Infiniti and I wasn't even out of the damn car before I had the same two walking up like they were my best friends. So I wasted their time for 20 minutes talking about the Audi before telling them I was there previously in my Yota shitbox and they ignored me probably assuming I couldn't afford anything, but now that I came in my Infiniti they were suddenly interested in a sale. They both got quiet, tried to backtrack but failed.

My worst experience was when I bought my X5 and had it delivered from Utah. Man, where to start with that one...

1) Part of the sale was an agreement that the dealership was going to fix paint wear on the drivers rocker from where the previous owner kept knocking snow off their boots. He "fixed" it and sent me photos. Of course the photos were doctored and all he did was use touchup paint and brushed it on.

2) They told me they only use licensed and insured transport companies with good reputation. Well the vehicle showed up with damage to the rear bumper because it was too close to the other vehicle on the trailer. Turns out he lied about who he ships with, the shipper was not licensed, not insured, and seemed to disappear from the face of the earth. He then offered to pay for the damage repairs but refused to pay what the body shop quoted.

3) He said the title would arrive a few days after the vehicle arrives. A week goes by, no title, so I call him on a Monday and he states he is physically looking at it on his desk and he was getting it overnighted that day. Thursday arrives and no title, so I call back, and this time he says he doesn't have it yet from his title guy and couldn't get it until tomorrow, but would get it sent out right away. It took 24 days after I received the vehicle to receive the title, which resulted in me having to pay an additional fee to transfer the vehicle because it was outside of the transfer window.

I happened to see a listing for a vehicle from them the other day and noticed the website stated they were closing down. Hmmm... I wonder why.

CTinline-six · 11-09-2021, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chassis

Commission based compensation. It’s the agency problem.

This. Also they very rarely (not saying all of them) know anything about the vehicle.

This is basically me whenever I walk into a dealership:

Joekerr · 11-09-2021, 12:36 PM

I love dealing with car salesmen / women. Though mostly men...out of the very many dealerships I've been too, it still seems to be a primarily male dominated industry.

But I enjoy negotiating, doesn't phase me, and I have zero problems with being that "one guy of the month" that the other person mentioned if I get what I want. If they aren't making something out of it, they'll turn you down. I'm not existing to make sure they get paid, that's the dealer's problem, not mine.

My wife just siccs me on them once she finds something she wants and then it is just me and the sales rep.

Internally though she's smiling when we go car shopping because these dealers get so enthused about maybe making a sale (pre COVID shortages) and I'm super nice to them and everything seems easy...but inside she's thinking (because she's mentioned this to me) "Oh you poor salesperson, you should just hope that we don't like your car, because you have no idea what my husband is going to turn into if we do."

That said, I've never dealt with American car salespeople...maybe different.

I think the most frustrating experience I had though was at a Kia dealership where one of my employees was looking to buy a Kia, so I volunteered to go with her and talk on her behalf because she isn't comfortable negotiating. The guy starts running the numbers based one the options we asked for and comes up with a monthly lease payment.

Meanwhile, I have Kia's lease calculator open on my phone, having already built the car there, and his numbers are drastically different. Like $100 more per month or something. So I ask him what gives. Well, he put this absolutely useless plan on without telling us which was part of it and that was all he could figure out. So I told him to take it off, he said he couldn't, it was policy, but he could put a discount equal to the plan to zero it out. I told him I didn't care what he did internally, but told him he had to get down to the numbers on the Kia website as a starting point and then we would negotiate from there.

He couldn't (or wouldn't) even get down to the numbers posted by Kia as a starting point, kept saying he was new to leasing and he was running back and forth to his manager. Got so frustrated with his incompetence that we just walked out.

TiMSport · 11-09-2021, 12:46 PM

I don't know how it works up there in Canada but whatever numbers are shown on an automaker's website related to leasing, they NEVER include sales tax or any other fees. As such, it's conceivable that numbers are off by $100 or so per month. Actual monthly numbers are often times drastically different from what is being advertised. That's how they get you in the door (and quite possibly out).

Alfisti · 11-09-2021, 01:06 PM

I am sure he is accounting for that. It is though, the stupidest thing about living here, no taxes listed etc, and don't give me this "different taxes in different states BS, it doesn't matter, list the price. OK second stupidest behind tipping.

In general, even before covid, i found dealers did VERY little in the way of deals, more than happy to have you walk out. I am polite etc, but still, no cigar.

My wife's Stelvio, I could barely make them budge on a $70K car that been on the lot 6 months, he was happy for me to walk out.

TiMSport · 11-09-2021, 01:09 PM

Well I guess Canada and the US are the same in that respect. They never include tax. I suppose that makes sense though because it does in fact matter where you live. In any case, most savvy car shoppers already know this.

Alfisti · 11-09-2021, 01:13 PM

Jesus H, it doesn't matter where you live. Just add the bloody tax. I will never understand the argument. If the product is 10K, advertise 10K in florida and $12k in California or whatever.

Same issue happens in reverse, I have had friends from Canada come to Australia OMG IT IS SO EXPENSIVE HERE, $22 FOR A HAMBURGER. I'm like chief, what's a hamburger in Toronto, $16.99? Add 30pc for tax and tip, maybe closer to 35% idf the tipping police have their way and you're right at $22.

10-28-2021, 04:51 PM	#24
BMW41049 Enlisted Member 51 Rep 39 Posts Drives: BMW X6 M50i 2021 Join Date: Sep 2021 Location: California iTrader: (0)	Our car salesman at our local BMW dealer was very cool. We bought two cars from him and were pretty happy with our deal. I've met some scamming lying dirtbags over the years and he was not in this category. The so called Genius however was useless and was anything but a Genius.
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10-28-2021, 04:59 PM	#26
Our03z4 Captain 1705 Rep 685 Posts Drives: 2008 BMW Z4 3.0si Coupe, Join Date: Nov 2016 Location: USA iTrader: (0)	This is one of the many reasons I ordered my newest car online. No haggling or games. It showed up on time and I had a PPI done that came back perfect. All in all A+ experience. Didn't have time to go to a dealer this time but it's never fun. Last truck I bought I was in and out in about 30mins, helped the dealer was about to close, I knew exactly what I wanted and they were a no haggle Ford dealer. (This is how all dealers should be)
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11-03-2021, 09:03 AM	#27
lsturbointeg Lieutenant General 9163 Rep 14,521 Posts Drives: 2011 535i Jet Black Join Date: Aug 2014 Location: Asian lost in OH iTrader: (0)	when i bought my Porsche the SA was very helpful and did everything i wanted him to do. This was by far the simplest transaction ever! i had more headaches buying my Honda Civic LOL! __________________ ~F90Conversion~21"3Piece Forged AvantGardeWheels~KWV1Coilovers~CQUENCE slotted/drilled rotors~GoodridgeStainlesslines~MeisterschaftQuadEx haust~Akrapovic 4"tips~VRSF DP~VRSF CP~TurboSmart BOV~K&N filter~CarbonFiberExteriorComponents~GladenAlphaCo mponents~MatchUp7BMW~Punch P300-12T~ Follow me on Instagram: lsturbointeg
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11-03-2021, 11:12 AM	#28
chassis Colonel 6621 Rep 2,323 Posts Drives: 9Y0 Cayenne S Join Date: Mar 2019 Location: Einbahnstraße iTrader: (0) Garage List 2020 Porsche Cayenne S [7.69]	Commission based compensation. It’s the agency problem.
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11-03-2021, 11:26 AM	#29
dreamingat30fps Lieutenant Colonel 5362 Rep 1,920 Posts Drives: Miata, Cayenne, Model 3, F350 Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: South Florida & NC iTrader: (1)	I have had very easy experiences for at LEAST the last 3-4 cars I've bought. I usually try to do 90% of everything online. My truck I found online at a dealer several hours away. I researched the dealer and they seemed to have a very good reputation. Did the whole deal over email even my trade and just drove there to pick it up. The model 3 was from Carvana, not the best deal but completely hassle free. The mustang and the corolla (that I sold a few months ago for more than I paid) were from no haggle dealers in and out. Now I will say I was helping my mom get a corolla (before I bought mine) and she lives in Miami. I have a rule that I NEVER go to dealers south of me and NEVER NO MATTER WHAT go to dealers in Miami. They are the worst of the worst the scummiest scumbags you will find (and they always advertise ridiculously low prices online). Anyways we picked her up and were headed north from Miami, but she decided to stop at a Toyota dealer halfway that supposedly had the car she wanted and had a good price online..... OMFG what a shit show. I won't go into the whole thing, but obviously the deal they told her was fake and I have 0 patience with these guys. I would just walk out instantly, but my mom is trying to be nice to this scumbag pos. Eventually I get her to leave with me and this fucking guy literally follows us to the car yelling and screaming that she will not get a better deal anywhere. I asked the guy if he wanted to get in the trunk and come with us. Most ridiculous experience I've ever had. Needless to say we drove to a no haggle dealer north of me and she got the exact car she wanted for a better deal with 0 drama. I later ended up getting my corolla from that same dealer hassle free.
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11-03-2021, 01:08 PM	#30
Higgs Boson In the Details 1810 Rep 867 Posts Drives: Yes Join Date: Jan 2020 Location: Texas Hill Country iTrader: (0) Garage List 2020 AMG GTR [0.00] 2022 R8 Quattro Spyder [0.00] 2023 X5M50 [0.00] 2023 718 Spyder [0.00] 2024 Silverado [0.00] 2024 Civic Type R [0.00]	The customer starts the haggle and hassle in the process the minute they ask for a discount. If everyone who searched online and called on the car they wanted just paid the online price the process would sure go a lot smoother and have no back and forth would it not? If you don't want to negotiate on a car then don't. The salesperson doesn't want to either. Pay it or just quietly go buy something somewhere else. But really, how many of you could adjust to and accept that process? Almost none. You'd rather try to work a discount and then complain. Tesla 2020 sales were under 500k units Ford 2 million GM 6.8 million FCA 2 million etc Tesla sells a fraction of what the other domestic brands sell and they do indeed have dealerships and service departments also. So really, your issue is with the franchising aspect of the retail location. The manufacturers make their money as soon as they wholesale the car to the dealer. After that, it's the dealer's problem. What about preowned auto sales? Teslas get sold used all the time. They aren't franchise stores, just completely independent operations. Some good, some bad.
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11-03-2021, 03:34 PM	#32
Germanauto Major General 9730 Rep 6,092 Posts Drives: Alfa Romeo Giulia, Rosso Join Date: Jul 2016 Location: LA iTrader: (0)	Car buying sucks. The overwhelming majority of car salespeople I've come across are varying degrees of unknowledgeable, pushy, or arrogrant. I can count on one hand how many fair and professional salespeople i've come across. OP I also hate when they try to lure you into the dealer. We live in a digital world, I always do my research and run my numbers online then reach out via email. They send some numbers, I counter with Leasehacker, etc. That's how it's supposed to work now. Only reason one should have to visit the showroom is the see and drive the car. Every now and then you come across a guy who is persistent (in a good way) and wants to cut a fair deal after some back-and-forth. No bs, not overly pushy, they're just straight with you. Hats off to those guys. __________________ Former -2008 E90 328 black/brown -2012 Lexus IS250 black/black
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11-03-2021, 09:00 PM	#33
Bunnny Private 220 Rep 63 Posts Drives: 2015 M4 & 2002 330ci e46 Join Date: Feb 2020 Location: AB, Canada iTrader: (0)	When I got my M4 from a luxury dealership, and walked into the salesman's office I noticed a billion tabs open about BMW's... He knew fuck all about anything to do with the car, and that was fine because I knew what I wanted and I did my research wayyyy before hand. Car was listed as "lava red" (sakhir orange), and you all should've seen this guy's face when this small woman told him that color doesn't actually exist. Priceless.
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11-04-2021, 08:32 AM	#34
vreihen16 Recovering Perfectionist 15465 Rep 946 Posts Drives: 2015 BMW i3 BEV Join Date: Jun 2019 Location: Orange County, NY iTrader: (0) Garage List 2014 Mighty Freight ... [0.00] 2015 BMW i3 BEV [0.00] 2000 Audi TT Quattro [0.00] 1967 Formula Vee [0.00]	When my wife bought her EV, the dealer's finance/closing guy tried to sell her a pre-paid oil change plan. I think that it was an honest mistake out of habit, since it was the first EV that they ever sold. The sales guy even admitted to watching all of the YouTube videos on the car the night before she picked it up, because he was obligated to provide an overview of everything at delivery and likewise had never seen an EV before. Whenever she goes to the dealership now, a small crowd of sales/parts/service people swarm her to look at the car and ask questions..... __________________ 2015 BMW i3 BEV, Giga World (Lodge interior), Tech/Driving Assist Packages, 30K miles
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11-04-2021, 08:40 AM	#35
bmwlover0725 Second Lieutenant 132 Rep 265 Posts Drives: 2008 M3 Coupe Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: Syracuse, NY iTrader: (1)	I could explain everything about why and how things operate at dealerships because my career is traveling to them throughout the country and training them, but I’ll spare you lol. Unfortunately, the car buying process sucks and there isn’t any end in sight for that (not for a while anyway). Your best bet is to go into the dealership in person. Tell them you don’t want any bullshit and as soon as they start (because they will), kindly remind them and ask to speak with a sales manager if you’ve had it. I know it sounds overly rude to do, but they aren’t there for your best interest. Just explain that you’re serious but you won’t be doing business with them if they play games. Just one thing to remember, they are there to make some kind of profit. It’s okay to negotiate, but I’ve always tried to avoid being the one guy of the month who basically steals something and isn’t welcome to show their face there again because of it. Good luck with the purchase and enjoy whatever you buy!
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11-04-2021, 09:04 AM	#36
Alfisti Brigadier General 6551 Rep 3,039 Posts Drives: 2008 Saab 9-3 Combi Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Toronto, Canada iTrader: (0)	Who's stealing anything in this climate? Lucky if you get out with a reasonable price let alone a deal.
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11-04-2021, 09:06 AM	#37
TheWatchGuy Colonel 3905 Rep 2,524 Posts Drives: 335xi Join Date: Mar 2018 Location: CO iTrader: (0)	with how easily it is to search for cars online, id bet 99% of emails dealers get about cars are from people that arent buying. Its not effective to treat every email as a potential buyer, which is why they want you in the dealership, because at that point, at least you have put some effort into the car and have some time invested as well. as to going to factory reps over dealerships and thinking youll get a better experience, LOL. the only thing that will be better is youll know the price you are paying before you walk in because they have no incentive to haggle. Those reps are still going to be paid commission, and will still push you to buy. Its just cutting out the local dealer aspect of it and replacing it with a national "dealer" basically. and if you are buying a car and wanting the salesperson to teach you about the car, youre already losing. car brands have what, 20+ models/trims/options/etc. its unrealistic to think they will know everything about the cars other than highlights. my things that have always worked for me when buying a car are I know everything about the car and the market for the car going in to the process and i have a max amount I'm willing to spend based on the market. I also am willing to travel, sometimes out of state, for the car I want and make that known early on in the process. If they dont want to match the price, I get that up front so Im not wasting my time or their time. __________________ @drunkcowatches on ig Am I a watch guy, or do i watch guys?
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11-08-2021, 11:42 PM	#38
///d Captain 1822 Rep 612 Posts Drives: F15 35d M Sport Join Date: Jan 2017 Location: Minne-snow-ta iTrader: (0)	Car salesman hate me. It's rare that I find one that knows more about a vehicle than I do and I'm not afraid to call them out when they try to bullshit me or anyone else on options/packages/service etc. I had a BMW salesman try to sell me a X5 M Sport saying it had M Adaptive because it's an M Sport and all M Sport have M Adaptive. I had to show him otherwise on the build sheet. He also tried to tell me that the 35d did not come with Drivers Assist Plus. Years ago I noticed an Audi that caught my eye at a local used car dealership. I was driving my 91 Yota beater truck that day. I was the only customer there at the time, I pulled in, noticed the guys inside watch me drive by the window, parked by the Audi, got out, walked around checking it out for a good 5 minutes, waited, walked around some other vehicles, one of the guys walked out and said he would be with me in a minute so I went back to the Audi, waited again. No one came out but I could see them inside just jaw-jacking over coffee and kept casually glancing over to see if I was there, so I left. Few days later for shits and giggles I went back in the Infiniti and I wasn't even out of the damn car before I had the same two walking up like they were my best friends. So I wasted their time for 20 minutes talking about the Audi before telling them I was there previously in my Yota shitbox and they ignored me probably assuming I couldn't afford anything, but now that I came in my Infiniti they were suddenly interested in a sale. They both got quiet, tried to backtrack but failed. My worst experience was when I bought my X5 and had it delivered from Utah. Man, where to start with that one... 1) Part of the sale was an agreement that the dealership was going to fix paint wear on the drivers rocker from where the previous owner kept knocking snow off their boots. He "fixed" it and sent me photos. Of course the photos were doctored and all he did was use touchup paint and brushed it on. 2) They told me they only use licensed and insured transport companies with good reputation. Well the vehicle showed up with damage to the rear bumper because it was too close to the other vehicle on the trailer. Turns out he lied about who he ships with, the shipper was not licensed, not insured, and seemed to disappear from the face of the earth. He then offered to pay for the damage repairs but refused to pay what the body shop quoted. 3) He said the title would arrive a few days after the vehicle arrives. A week goes by, no title, so I call him on a Monday and he states he is physically looking at it on his desk and he was getting it overnighted that day. Thursday arrives and no title, so I call back, and this time he says he doesn't have it yet from his title guy and couldn't get it until tomorrow, but would get it sent out right away. It took 24 days after I received the vehicle to receive the title, which resulted in me having to pay an additional fee to transfer the vehicle because it was outside of the transfer window. I happened to see a listing for a vehicle from them the other day and noticed the website stated they were closing down. Hmmm... I wonder why.
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11-09-2021, 12:36 PM	#40
Joekerr Banned 7939 Rep 1,923 Posts Drives: 2017 Audi S6 Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Toronto, ON iTrader: (0)	I love dealing with car salesmen / women. Though mostly men...out of the very many dealerships I've been too, it still seems to be a primarily male dominated industry. But I enjoy negotiating, doesn't phase me, and I have zero problems with being that "one guy of the month" that the other person mentioned if I get what I want. If they aren't making something out of it, they'll turn you down. I'm not existing to make sure they get paid, that's the dealer's problem, not mine. My wife just siccs me on them once she finds something she wants and then it is just me and the sales rep. Internally though she's smiling when we go car shopping because these dealers get so enthused about maybe making a sale (pre COVID shortages) and I'm super nice to them and everything seems easy...but inside she's thinking (because she's mentioned this to me) "Oh you poor salesperson, you should just hope that we don't like your car, because you have no idea what my husband is going to turn into if we do." That said, I've never dealt with American car salespeople...maybe different. I think the most frustrating experience I had though was at a Kia dealership where one of my employees was looking to buy a Kia, so I volunteered to go with her and talk on her behalf because she isn't comfortable negotiating. The guy starts running the numbers based one the options we asked for and comes up with a monthly lease payment. Meanwhile, I have Kia's lease calculator open on my phone, having already built the car there, and his numbers are drastically different. Like $100 more per month or something. So I ask him what gives. Well, he put this absolutely useless plan on without telling us which was part of it and that was all he could figure out. So I told him to take it off, he said he couldn't, it was policy, but he could put a discount equal to the plan to zero it out. I told him I didn't care what he did internally, but told him he had to get down to the numbers on the Kia website as a starting point and then we would negotiate from there. He couldn't (or wouldn't) even get down to the numbers posted by Kia as a starting point, kept saying he was new to leasing and he was running back and forth to his manager. Got so frustrated with his incompetence that we just walked out.
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11-09-2021, 12:46 PM	#41
TiMSport Banned 12807 Rep 2,983 Posts Drives: '21 M340i xDrive, '17 Audi S3 Join Date: Feb 2021 Location: ATL iTrader: (0)	I don't know how it works up there in Canada but whatever numbers are shown on an automaker's website related to leasing, they NEVER include sales tax or any other fees. As such, it's conceivable that numbers are off by $100 or so per month. Actual monthly numbers are often times drastically different from what is being advertised. That's how they get you in the door (and quite possibly out).
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11-09-2021, 01:06 PM	#42
Alfisti Brigadier General 6551 Rep 3,039 Posts Drives: 2008 Saab 9-3 Combi Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Toronto, Canada iTrader: (0)	I am sure he is accounting for that. It is though, the stupidest thing about living here, no taxes listed etc, and don't give me this "different taxes in different states BS, it doesn't matter, list the price. OK second stupidest behind tipping. In general, even before covid, i found dealers did VERY little in the way of deals, more than happy to have you walk out. I am polite etc, but still, no cigar. My wife's Stelvio, I could barely make them budge on a $70K car that been on the lot 6 months, he was happy for me to walk out.
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11-09-2021, 01:09 PM	#43
TiMSport Banned 12807 Rep 2,983 Posts Drives: '21 M340i xDrive, '17 Audi S3 Join Date: Feb 2021 Location: ATL iTrader: (0)	Well I guess Canada and the US are the same in that respect. They never include tax. I suppose that makes sense though because it does in fact matter where you live. In any case, most savvy car shoppers already know this.
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11-09-2021, 01:13 PM	#44
Alfisti Brigadier General 6551 Rep 3,039 Posts Drives: 2008 Saab 9-3 Combi Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Toronto, Canada iTrader: (0)	Jesus H, it doesn't matter where you live. Just add the bloody tax. I will never understand the argument. If the product is 10K, advertise 10K in florida and $12k in California or whatever. Same issue happens in reverse, I have had friends from Canada come to Australia OMG IT IS SO EXPENSIVE HERE, $22 FOR A HAMBURGER. I'm like chief, what's a hamburger in Toronto, $16.99? Add 30pc for tax and tip, maybe closer to 35% idf the tipping police have their way and you're right at $22.
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