[LEDZEP]

I agree you should just let it go. Take the higher road. It's not worth the agrivation anyway.

While the survey system may not be what we like, it is what it is. If you are satified with your dealer and sales person you should give all 5's. If you are not satisfied give less. It's their system not ours. Don't penalize your sales person to try and prove a point to BMW. I could not be happier with my sales experience and was only too happy to give the highest marks.

P.S. Time for this thread to die, I think.

[vivid]

I agree, I would not let this rest... or rather I would once the sales guy had lost his job...

This guy gives BMW, your dealer and car sales people in general a bad name... And if you do nothing he will do it again... If you don’t want to do it for the way he treated you then think of it as community service for all of his potential clients.

[silverado]

Originally Posted by jubol

I was thinking about this whole survey problem!!
When they survey me, I'm going to say NO SURVEY!! When they ask why?? Because you give our survey results paired to names, which I think is totaly wrong!!!
If all the folks on this and other boards did the same as I'm going to do, I think BMW would get the MESSAGE!!!
Fred

I don't have a problem with linking it to names. If I don't like their service and they know it, they are bound to do better by me next time. The problem is the scoring system (or what the sales people are claiming the scoring system to be).

[F30Toad]

Taking the high road is more than I could do.

You now have to feel uncomfortable everytime you walk into that dealer for parts or service. No telling what that guy does the next time he sees you and your car come in for service. If he was "so shocked" that he sent the first email, what is his excuse for the threats in the 2nd. He doesn't care about you or your family, that he already proved, no matter what the last email said.

Let the dealer know that you now feel completely uncomfortable with any future dealings with them due to this guy and ask them what they will do about it. Put it on them to make you feel comfortable, that is there job.

[rEvVoMaNiAc]

Originally Posted by ward

fortunately you're in the bay like me,

we've got san fransisco, san jose, fremont, mountain view, pleasanton, concord, san mateo to choose from

I've thought the guys at pleasanton are the best, but I'd also say mountain view is good. Fremont and Concord are big volume lower class type establishments from what I've seen.

I bet your bad experience was at fremont or concord

Originally Posted by drfluid

You missed just one place in the Bay Area

Originally Posted by HRC

Weatherford BMW. First name not Bruce?

Danny

It's already clear which dealership it is. Weatherford BMW in the Bay area. The GM knows who gave less-than-perfect surveys to which salesperson, so all that would have to happen is for someone to email Weatherford BMW's GM and link him/her to the thread in question.

I'm not going to do it, since I don't want to intrude on the guy's private life. But technically, anyone on this board could send that email.

[silverado]

Originally Posted by rEvVoMaNiAc

It's already clear which dealership it is. Weatherford BMW in the Bay area. The GM knows who gave less-than-perfect surveys to which salesperson, so all that would have to happen is for someone to email Weatherford BMW's GM and link him/her to the thread in question.

I'm not going to do it, since I don't want to intrude on the guy's private life. But technically, anyone on this board could send that email.

But you seem to be hoping/encouraging that someone do it

[Done]

<-----

[rEvVoMaNiAc]

Well, I can't deny that I would like to see a jerk like that lose his job. But drfuild has already made a decision to let it go, so all I can do is sit here and fantasize "what if."

Props to drfluid though. I wouldn't have had that kind of composure.

BTW, the reason I'm posting in this thread for the first time is because this thread is starting to make its way over the net and I heard about it from another site. Whether that email ever gets sent or not, this particular dealership is soon to be infamous.

[CC 330i]

I would have liked to have seen a little more in the way of an apology from the salesperson. It appears that he has thought better of his actions and wants to put it behind him.

I think if drfluid feels that he wants to let it go, then he should. The one caveat being that he needs to be assured that he will be treated well by the dealership and by this salesperson in the future. It really was between drfluid and this salesperson, and nobody else.

It's true that this guy should probably not be working for BMW any longer, because he might do this type of thing again, but if drfluid feels that he is comfortable with the situation, then it's his call. I know drfluid felt bad about originally telling the salesperson that he would give him all 5s, and then when the survey person called, giving him mostly 4s. I am sure the salesperson felt betrayed by drfluid, and thus the reason for his original email. We all agree that email, and the one that followed, was wrong. (But we never did see the full text of either email).

But the truth is, the salesperson should not have asked for 5s in the first place, or even mentioned the survey. It is not professional to bring it up at any point in the sales process. We are spending at least $35K in most cases, and in many cases much more, and we don't need to be burdened with such a process. BMW should get all the information they need from SALES NUMBERS! The survey will only work if the salespeople stop thinking their BONUS is an entitlement. The survey will only work to improve dealers and salespeople if there is another acceptable score other than all 5s.

As I mentioned before, in my company, I would never expect all 5s on my reviews (we use a 1-5 scale too) because that would be BS. It's like "grade inflation" in schools where we are giving out 4.8's and stuff like that, when 4.0 should be the highest. (I know about AP classes counting for more, but come on!). You can't honestly say that there is no room for improvement when a student has a 4.0 or a 4.8. Why keep going to school? We can always improve on something.

I am so mad at this salesperson that I seriously want to go up there and make trouble for him, but his half-hearted apology has satisfied at least me for now. I would rather that he be fired immediately and sent packing, so that no one else has to be threatened by him (and both his emails were basically threats... "don't come back to this dealership", and "I AM NOT ONE OF YOUR CHATROOM ACADEMICS").

This chatroom academic seriously wants to go up there and kick his f***ing ass, and I might still, but for now I am satisfied that he has thought better of his stupidity.

[noflash]

Longest thread ever!

I am just glad it's over.

Congrats drfluid.

What is that anyway -- drfluid?

Are you a urologist?

[DaveCM5]

Originally Posted by drfluid

I also have a question on the regular BMW meintenance when my 'relationship' has been ruined like this.
He said he wouldn't want to deal with me anymore and does that mean that I can't go to the dealer for the maintenance that is covered by the warranty?

What should I do if I have any further inquires and/or problem with my car??

First and last, the salesman can go F**K himself. You gave him a good a score. If he didn't get his bonus, then TOO F**KING BAD. If I was you, he could kiss my ass. And when I did go to the dealer to get my car serviced, I'd make it a point to find him just so I could say "Hey!" and give him the finger everytime for sending that email.

He's a turd, so just forget about it. If the BMW dealer doesn't service your car properly, call BMW-NA and let them know. They'll fix it right. It's thier job... and BTW, do you really think the dealership's management actually cares if this guy got his bonus or not? If you do, then you don't know car dealerships. Salesmen are generally expendable.

The sales guy might be sore about it, but the rest of the dealership will treat you like any other customer.

-Dave C. '06 330i

[DaveCM5]

Originally Posted by drfluid

BUT I CAUTION YOU, DON'T EVER THREATEN ME LIKE THAT AGAIN. I DON'T
TAKE KINDLY TO THAT. YOU'RE NOT DEALING WITH ONE ONE OF YOUR CHAT ROOM ACADEMICS.
===========================
Last sentences were capitalized by him, I guess, to warn me the consequencies if I report to his supervisor or someone high up.

I still have no intention to harm him in any way, but what should I do? I don't even understand why this kinds of shitty things are happening to me...
Damn survey!!!

EWWWW!!!! I didn't read this part yet!!! No intention to harm him???? Oh buddy!!! I'd be over there when they open in the morning, grab that jerk by the neck, drag him into the bathroom and flush his friggin' head in the toilet while I was kicking him in the a$$!!!! No one would talk to me that way. Don't let this guy get away with this!
:mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

-Dave C. '06 330i


PS: You could actually have a lawsuit against the dealership if you wanted because this is all due to the business transaction, and that guy is an employee.

[drfluid]

Thanks for all your concerns.
I understand that you would get mad if I won't do anything against this salesperson. But, the decision was made after hours of thinking about the situations and the possible consequencies.

I learned a lesson and hopefully so did he.

He was generally nice to me and my family when he tried to sell the car and until the moment I got this troublesome emails.
I see he was just upset and "shocked" to see the bad scores from my response to the survey. I know his email in the first place was not very appropriate, but I believe he wouldn't ack like this in the future any more. So I hope...

I don't want any more action taken at this point. That's my final decision.
Although I'm not doing anything about it, I'm still not implying to encourage people to go to the dealership and buy the car from the same person.

Originally Posted by noflash

Longest thread ever!

I am just glad it's over.

Congrats drfluid.

What is that anyway -- drfluid?

Are you a urologist?

That's good!
Actually, I'm a fluid mechanician with a civil engineering background.

Originally Posted by Dave C. '06 330i

First and last, the salesman can go F**K himself. You gave him a good a score. If he didn't get his bonus, then TOO F**KING BAD. If I was you, he could kiss my ass. And when I did go to the dealer to get my car serviced, I'd make it a point to find him just so I could say "Hey!" and give him the finger everytime for sending that email.

He's a turd, so just forget about it. If the BMW dealer doesn't service your car properly, call BMW-NA and let them know. They'll fix it right. It's thier job... and BTW, do you really think the dealership's management actually cares if this guy got his bonus or not? If you do, then you don't know car dealerships. Salesmen are generally expendable.

The sales guy might be sore about it, but the rest of the dealership will treat you like any other customer.

-Dave C. '06 330i

Thanks. That's much better!

[LWL]

I didn't plan to reply to this thread until I read the name of the dealership.....WEATHERFORD...... I had a really bad experience with them recently, too, that's why I took the business else where and got a really really good service.

Well, from the incident of drfluid and mine own encounter, I think the dealership itself has some management problem. In my case, to keep it short, I requested a refund on my deposit becuase I got into arguements with the salesperson there, and yea, the salesperson actually YELLED at me on the phone TWICE becuase I wanted to cancel my order due to the bad attitude that she gave me. When I told her that since we both weren't happy about each other, I would just cancel my order and I want my deposit back, and she told me "well, you won't be able to get your deposit back because senior managers won't feel happy about it and they wouldn't let you get back your deposit!!!" I was like, what the heck, that's totally BS b/c when I put down my deposit, she told me its refundable no matter what reason, and I didn't sign anything saying that my order is a non-refundable order. So according to the CA law, they MUST refund the deposit to me.

I was so pissed about the attitude of the saleslady, so I called the GM the next day, told him what happened, and he said he was sorry for what happened to me and that the salesperson shouldn't have talked to me like that and they have no reason to hold my deposit whatsoever. I told him that he didn't need to apologize to me, its the saleslady who did it wrong. He replied that they serve as one whole entity and he was responsible for what happen to me at the dealership. Then, after his apology, he transfered me to Sales GM who would be able to process my refund for me.

After transferring to Sales GM, I told my story and he again, apologized for what happened and would help me to talk with my saleslady and asked me if he can arrange another salesperson to service me, I said okay. Then, no communication from him for 3 days until I could get a hold on him. I felt pissed again that he was so not responsible. He said he talked with the salesperson and asked her to give me back my deposit already, and he would talk with her again to check on the status. I called next day, Sales GM told me yes, the lady gave me back my deposit. Its a great news wasn't it........ but no, it didn't ended like that.

I knew it took 5 to 10 days for the refund transaction to post on my record, I waited 2 weeks, still nothing. I called the Sales GM again, he again said that he already asked the salesperson to refund it, and would check wtih her again. I told him since I had some arguement with her, I don't think she would really do it, and I kindly asked him if he could just do the refund by himself. He told me "I have to talk to XXX since she had all your paperwork, and I CAN'T do anything about it."............ I was freaking surprising when he said that to me. You are a Sales GM and you can't even have control over your own people!! I waited another 2 weeks, no communication from him. I called, he told me the same thing that he would check for me. I felt this would just be an endless process, and felt so discourage to keep calling the GM because he CAN"T DO ANYTHING b/c he DOESN"T HAVE THE PAPERWORK. I wonder what he does at work.

I was totally disappointed to the Sales GM, and so I took the issue to credit card company and dispute the charge, and its still pending now. If the dispute dont' go through, I will take the issue and report to BMWNA or BBB, if it doesn't work out, I will probably file the case with small claim court. This is NOT about money, this is about the professionalism of the dealership, and get back what I deserved.

Anyhow, I am already driving my new E90 on the road happily, I wouldn't let this fraustrated thing bother me with my happiness of owning this new vehicle. Buying a new car suppose to be a happy, exciting process, but when the dealer ruined the experience, they have to pay it back.

drfluid, since the salesman apologized for his act, you should let it go, I bet he learned his lesson, unlike my salesperson. You should enjoy your new car from now on!! See you on the road!

[drfluid]

LWL, that's another bad experience from Weatherford..

BTW, where did you end up buying a car? and where do you plan to get the service done in future?

[LWL]

Originally Posted by drfluid

LWL, that's another bad experience from Weatherford..

BTW, where did you end up buying a car? and where do you plan to get the service done in future?

PeterPan. I know some people had bad experience at Peterpan before, but the guy I had a deal with is very reputable in the area, and my experience backed it up.

[romeo26]

okay well i didnt want to read this hole thread because its 7 pages long!!! heres what i would do:
first save the email on a floppy or cd, and keep a copy on your hd. print out a copy.
fwd the email to bmwna and bmwag (i think thats what it is), then send it to the dealer manerger or who ever is on the top of the food chain.
oh yah remember to put how you feel in the email.

then kick back and relax and let bmw handle this matter!!!

well thats me.
my friends would bash his car and his face(there more violent then iam)

[OdyClubMember]

Here is how the scoring works for both the sales and the service departments.....
1 2 3 4 5
1=0% 2=25% 3=50% 4=75% 5=100%
Where I went to scool a 75% would be D on my report card.
If I as a service advisor or a saleman received a D on my report card from you I would be very upset.

However, I do not support the email that this salesman sent at all.

IF he had to send an email it should have been one on how sorry he was that he had received a D in his dealings with you and what do you think he could have done in order to improve himself for the next customer. There is NO way in the world that it was the 2nd worse score he has ever received. He just out and out lied about that.

[sergiodimarco]

I was actually sort of disapointed at the knowledge of my dealer about the e90.
did people have a similar feeling about the sales expierience/knowledge of the sales rep?



Absolutely!!!

I had to let several sales reps in on the various, and basic differences between the 325's and 330's and their respective standard options. While we cant paint all reps with the same brush, I concluded that I knew MUCH more about the car I was purchasing then they did primarily because of these forums.
I remember the stunned look on one reps face when I pointed out the chrome kidney grill slats, and the titanium slash across the air damn. (schmuck!) Needless to sat, I bought elsewhere.

BTW. My 330 e90 now has almost 2k kilometers, with no sign of anything wrong at all. Nothing! This is one great car!

[CC 330i]

Yes I really don't think it's too much to ask, when buying a huge capital investment like a car, for the salesperson to know more than the buyer. It's really pitiful. I get a kick out of how so many car salespeople know very little about cars in general, much less the ones they are selling.

[djfreex]

I do not wanna believe that a BMW salesperson can write you those emails. Especially someone who has sold many cars and have experience.
You tried to fix things - he passed.
He does not leave you much to do
BBB his a...!
Contact GM/BMWNA.

We are talking a premium purchase here. Premium purchases needs premium salespeople. You are not buying a commuter vehicle, you are buying the ultimate driving machine.

No customer deserves this kind of behaviour, especially with your endless effort to fix things. I kinda respect that you are being mature and thinking for the guy too. I do not know if I would be that way after a min $35K purchase.

[cosmosblau]

Originally Posted by CC 330i

Yes I really don't think it's too much to ask, when buying a huge capital investment like a car, for the salesperson to know more than the buyer. It's really pitiful. I get a kick out of how so many car salespeople know very little about cars in general, much less the ones they are selling.

First of all, these aren't bright people in general. Even BMW salesmen are usually under-educated. Almost NONE of them have college degrees, and they don't make much. They deal with rich people every day (and they do their credit apps, so they know EXACTLY how much we make), and are unfortunately resentful. Their bonuses allow them to get a BMW for themselves to drive and it's all contingent on the bullshit "5" rating.

When I bought my car, I had a multitude of problems. When I complained, The manager told my saleswoman to "Let him go" for fear that I would give them a bad rating. They would rather sacrifice the sale then get a bad rating.

I have decided that I will give them no rating at all, since the rating system is corrupt.