Time for a reality check and some nostalgia....

[Driver72]

I know sometimes conversations about our various BMW's can get a bit heated on this forums.
I thought it was time for a bit of a reality check on just how special our "normal" cars and BMW's are these days.
Though I'm sure it has changed a bit in the past year with the economy in the dumps, but it seems more often even 18-22 year old kids have very nice cars like the 335i and even M3 (most of the time getting them because they are spoiled by their parents).

Like probably many on these boards, I grew up in the 80's (puberty, jr high, high school, first car, etc) and I wanted to remind some and show others what WE of my generation had when it came to performance and what the exotics and dream cars did in the realm of performance. Cars we could never have as teenagers and young adults, and back then certainly VERY FEW parents bought their kids M3's, much less even the regular 3 series.

During the late 80's here were a few of the cars many teenagers and young adults could only hope they could get, but often drove much older cars:


1988 Acura Integra LS
$12,500-13,500
113 hp
0-60 in 9.1
1/4 in 16.8 @ 81.5
60-0 in 162 feet
.82g's on skidpad

1988 Toyota Celica GT-S
$15,000-17,600
135 hp
0-60 in 8.6
1/4 in 16.5 @ 84.0
60-0 in 151 feet
.81g's on skidpad

1988 VW GTI 16V
134 hp
$12,600-15,500
0-60 in 8.5
1/4 in 16.5 @ 84.0
60-0 in 149 feet
.83g's on skidpad

Now, if you were lucky, you might of been able to get a turbo 4 or V6 car, which was often these desirable models:

1988 Nissan 200SX SE-V6
165 hp
$15,600-17,000
0-60 in 8.1 sec
1/4 in 16.2 @ 86.0
60-0 in 144 feet
.78g's on skidpad

1988 Mazda MX-6 GT (turbo 2.2L)
145 hp
$14,500-16,000
0-60 in 7.2
1/4 in 15.5 @ 89.2
60-0 in 137 feet
.80g's on skidpad

1988 Dodge Daytona Shelby Z (turbo 2.2L)
174 hp
$13,000-16,000
0-60 in 7.2 sec
1/4 in 15.5 @ 88.5
60-0 in 155 feet
.83g's on skidpad

Now, if you could afford the insurance and were able to pick up a pony car (or certain V8 powered cars) you got:

1988 Ford Mustang GT
225 hp
$12,500-14,000
0-60 in 6.0 sec
1/4 in 14.6 @ 97.0
60-0 in 168 feet
.83g's on skidpad

1988 Chevy Camaro IROC-Z (5.0 manual)
215 hp
$17,000-21,000
0-60 in 6.6 sec
1/4 in 14.9 @ 95.0
60-0 in 160 feet
.87 g's on skidpad
**Note here, the Camaro/Trans Am was offered in 5.7 liter too but only made 10 hp and 20 lb-ft torque more. But was auto only so it was within .1 second and 1 mph of the 5.0 manual.

1988 Toyota Supra
$20,000-21,000
200 hp
0-60 in 7.5 sec
1/4 in 15.9 @ 86.5
60-0 in 147 feet
.86g's on skidpad

1988 Mazda RX-7 Turbo
182 hp
$21,000-22,000
0-60 in 6.6 sec
1/4 in 15.2 @ 92.5
60-0 in 154 feet
.85g's on skidpad

Now the teenager dream cars that we could never have but surely had some posters of on the wall:

1987 Ferrari Testarossa
380 hp
$102,000+
0-60 in 5.3 sec
1/4 in 13.4 @ 106.5
60-0 in 150 feet
.87g's on skidpad

1987 Lamborghini Countach
420 hp
$125,000
0-60 in 5.2 sec
1/4 in 13.7 @ 108.0
60-0 in 152 feet
.88 g's on skidpad

1987 Porsche 911 Turbo
282 hp
$58,000-60,000
0-60 in 5.0 sec
1/4 in 13.4 @ 103.0
60-0 in 143 feet
.84 g's on skidpad

For the luxury minded:

1987 Mercedes Benz 560SL
227 hp
$55,000
0-60 in 7.5 sec
1/4 in 15.8 @ 91.0
60-0 in 142 feet
.78g's on skidpad

1987 BMW 635 CSi
182 hp
$46,000
0-60 in 8.5 sec
1/4 in 16.3 @ 86.0
60-0 in 149 feet
.80g's on skidpad

and for those of us who were around and remember the release of the very first BMW M3:
192 hp
$34,000
0-60 in 8.1 sec
1/4 in 16.1 @ 88.3
60-0 in 130 feet
.82g's on skidpad



In today's times some midsize and even large SUV's now accelerate, handle and brake as well as the "performance cars" of 20+ years ago.
It's humbling to know a stock 335i could run with a Ferrari, or Lambo, or Porsche 911 Turbo of 20-22 years ago, and with a stock M3 or a $500 chip on the 335i just humiliate them.
Keepin it real. Enjoy.

[Draman]

I just want to say just as many people were buying their kids BMWs and the like 20+ years ago, there just wasn't an internet around to tell you about it.

[skoot3r]

Originally Posted by Draman

I just want to say just as many people were buying their kids BMWs and the like 20+ years ago, there just wasn't an internet around to tell you about it.

+1

[Driver72]

Originally Posted by Draman

I just want to say just as many people were buying their kids BMWs and the like 20+ years ago, there just wasn't an internet around to tell you about it.

I don't know about that.
I lived not too far from some of the most upscale neighborhoods in the large city I grew up in. And spent a decent amount of time at the mall that many of the spoiled kids went too.
I knew of VERY few kids who had BMW's in high school, and not too many in college either.

That's like saying just as many kids had computer games, and all the latest gadgets 20 years ago as they do now.
I see 9-10 year olds now with iphones for sh-t sake. Not to mention Ipods, Wii's, and every other electronic gizmo made.
And I'm sure many of them now also have 42" LCD's in their bedrooms too (with DVD or Blu-ray players as well). In the 80's you were spoiled if you had a 13" TV in your room, and honestly most I knew (including myself) didn't have TV's in their rooms growing up.

In 20 years car prices have a little more than doubled in price.
For a high school or college kid to even drive a $48K 335i, that would be like someone driving a $22-23k car in the late 80's.
A high schooler would be lucky to have a $5-10k car in the 80's and spoiled to have a $15k car.
Kids are A LOT more spoiled today. No comparison.
But that's also partly because people have a lot more money today than they did in the 80's too. Well they did up until this past year, now many are broke. That's a lot to do with the spoiled nature of this country now, everybody spending more than they can afford and going into big debt. That also wasn't nearly the case in the 80's. Americans are A LOT more greedy these days, hence more spoiled kids too.

[Plan B]

^^^ I agree for the most part.

The amount of money made and the amount of people who made them have certainly accelerated in recent years. We are in a economic correction now that will hopefully recalibrate some sanity back to our consumer culture.

[EmPower]

Originally Posted by Driver72

I don't know about that.
I lived not too far from some of the most upscale neighborhoods in the large city I grew up in. And spent a decent amount of time at the mall that many of the spoiled kids went too.
I knew of VERY few kids who had BMW's in high school, and not too many in college either.

That's like saying just as many kids had computer games, and all the latest gadgets 20 years ago as they do now.
I see 9-10 year olds now with iphones for sh-t sake. Not to mention Ipods, Wii's, and every other electronic gizmo made.
And I'm sure many of them now also have 42" LCD's in their bedrooms too (with DVD or Blu-ray players as well). In the 80's you were spoiled if you had a 13" TV in your room, and honestly most I knew (including myself) didn't have TV's in their rooms growing up.

In 20 years car prices have a little more than doubled in price.
For a high school or college kid to even drive a $48K 335i, that would be like someone driving a $22-23k car in the late 80's.
A high schooler would be lucky to have a $5-10k car in the 80's and spoiled to have a $15k car.
Kids are A LOT more spoiled today. No comparison.
But that's also partly because people have a lot more money today than they did in the 80's too. Well they did up until this past year, now many are broke. That's a lot to do with the spoiled nature of this country now, everybody spending more than they can afford and going into big debt. That also wasn't nearly the case in the 80's. Americans are A LOT more greedy these days, hence more spoiled kids too.

What makes me want to cry right now is that you get get a Testarossa for 100K, I mean you can BARELY get an S550 for that money today.. and considering a V12 powered SL560 for a little over 50K or a 911 turbo for sub 50K price. Mind you though, dont let the puny hp #s fool you. The kerb weight of cars 20 years ago was at an average 1000lbs less than the replacements we see today, meaning they could still be quick enough.

[ragingclue]

Well, the inflated increase in net worth, followed by lending corresponding to said increase has allowed many people to get into nice cars who wouldn't have been able to previously....

[Driver72]

Originally Posted by EmPower

What makes me want to cry right now is that you get get a Testarossa for 100K, I mean you can BARELY get an S550 for that money today.. and considering a V12 powered SL560 for a little over 50K or a 911 turbo for sub 50K price. Mind you though, dont let the puny hp #s fool you. The kerb weight of cars 20 years ago was at an average 1000lbs less than the replacements we see today, meaning they could still be quick enough.

No doubt.
What's even funnier (or not) is a nice Testarossa today will probably cost you 100k
Countach was 3285 lbs. That's lighter than a 135i
Testarossa was 3660 lbs. Lighter than an M3 now.
SL560 was 3780 lbs with hardtop on. Now they are like 4300 lbs.
Porsche 911 Turbo was 2975 lbs.
Honda Civic Si was 1980 lbs.

**Edit: Just wanted to congratulate Chevy. Was looking over the specs of the 1986-1987 Corvette. It was a 5.7 liter V8 that made 230 hp and 330 tq.
Did 0-60 in 5.8 seconds and 1/4 in 14.4 @ 98.0 mph (the only V8 powered American car that was faster than the Mustang GT in the late 80's).
But it weighed 3280 lbs back then, and by God, that's about what they weigh still NOW.
That's progress. Making the car far superior, far safer, far faster, far more rigid, but still weighs about the same.
If only every other car manufacturer did the same. Cars would still get great gas mileage, be faster and handle even better than they do.
Just think of the M3 now if it still weighed 3100 lbs!!

[blue2fire]

You are right.