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      05-02-2022, 03:04 PM   #23
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How does value not factor into a car being overrated? Dollar to performance ratio matters.
You're right, but the OP was just complaining that he couldn't swing it atm, not that it wasn't worth it. At least that's my impression of his rant haha.
That's me, I'm the OP

I'm not in the market atm, but just my observations since I've worked on a few 991s this last week. Market sucks butt, yes. But also I've been underwhelmed by all of the PDK-equipped cars I've driven. Maybe a GT3 would change my mind
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      05-02-2022, 03:07 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spooni View Post
That's me, I'm the OP

I'm not in the market atm, but just my observations since I've worked on a few 991s this last week. Market sucks butt, yes. But also I've been underwhelmed by all of the PDK-equipped cars I've driven. Maybe a GT3 would change my mind
Haha, ok (This site ought to have the "OP" for OPs like other sites.)

So, it's more of a MT vs AT thing then? You kinda have many things going on, e.g. trannies, $$$, the brands.
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      05-02-2022, 03:25 PM   #25
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Have you considered a "classic" Porsche? We have a '79 and a '93 and they are fantastic if you want to have some analog fun.
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      05-02-2022, 03:27 PM   #26
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Just showing OP that almost everyone wants one, they just figure that they are overpriced.
Well I got news for the OP, the prices aren't coming down anytime soon. I waited too to see if the prices of the 997 S would come down and now they are 20k+ for the same car from 2 years ago.
Even 996's prices are on the rise.
I actually expect a liiiiiiitle softening but tbh not enough to make or break buying one now if the right car comes along.

The big differentiator is the weight, that's the one thing no other vehicle has other than frs/miata at half the HP.

Otherwise, would seriously consider the maserati or shaguar.
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      05-02-2022, 03:44 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by P1 View Post
Have you considered a "classic" Porsche? We have a '79 and a '93 and they are fantastic if you want to have some analog fun.
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Originally Posted by tranquility View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by spooni View Post
That's me, I'm the OP

I'm not in the market atm, but just my observations since I've worked on a few 991s this last week. Market sucks butt, yes. But also I've been underwhelmed by all of the PDK-equipped cars I've driven. Maybe a GT3 would change my mind
Haha, ok (This site ought to have the "OP" for OPs like other sites.)

So, it's more of a MT vs AT thing then? You kinda have many things going on, e.g. trannies, $$$, the brands.
Just my .02, call it a rant if you please. But also curious on what people would choose over a 911


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Just showing OP that almost everyone wants one,
Hence: "unpopular opinion"

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Originally Posted by P1 View Post
Have you considered a "classic" Porsche? We have a '79 and a '93 and they are fantastic if you want to have some analog fun.
Oldest 911 I've driven was 996. So maybe I'll give the air cooled cars a go!
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      05-02-2022, 04:10 PM   #28
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This is a nice out-of-the-box thinking exercise for me, because the 911 is my favorite car of all time.

A natural progression from the E90 if the 911 is off the table, for around $100k? I’d say look for the best, cleanest manual naturally aspirated Cayman you can find in that budget. You can probably get into a 981 GT4 for that money. They’re nimbler, sound better, and the Porsche manual gearbox is sublime.

Btw i traded in my E90 M3 for an M4 GTS. That’s actually in your $100k budget still if you want to check those out too. Or an M3/M4 CS.
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      05-02-2022, 04:19 PM   #29
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This is a nice out-of-the-box thinking exercise for me, because the 911 is my favorite car of all time.

A natural progression from the E90 if the 911 is off the table, for around $100k? I'd say look for the best, cleanest manual naturally aspirated Cayman you can find in that budget. You can probably get into a 981 GT4 for that money. They're nimbler, sound better, and the Porsche manual gearbox is sublime.

Btw i traded in my E90 M3 for an M4 GTS. That's actually in your $100k budget still if you want to check those out too. Or an M3/M4 CS.
GT4 has seemed to climb out of the 100 range now. Most examples near me are $120-140k..

The M4 GTS would be lovely, and I've flirted with the idea. Especially if they come down from the current price point(likely not, unless we're talking higher mileage cars or something). I'm just not sure it's "exotic" enough for me.
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      05-02-2022, 04:28 PM   #30
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GT4 has seemed to climb out of the 100 range now. Most examples near me are $120-140k..
Hmmm, ok. I haven’t been tracking the market but i suppose i shouldn’t be surprised. So, the 981 GTS then? Although that probably won’t feel faster than the E90…
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      05-02-2022, 04:35 PM   #31
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Time to man up and get the GT500 instead. Sounds great, lots of road presence, tons of midrange power.
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      05-02-2022, 05:20 PM   #32
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I'd take GT350 over GT500 an day and I think it is the answer to what ails the OP.
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      05-02-2022, 05:34 PM   #33
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under 100k i'd look for a 6 cylinder cayman. not sure if a newer 718 4.0 can be had for that or not though.

AMG GT or GTS ? probably the closest 911 rival. unlike the vantage it uses a dct. weight is pretty low. good power. can be tuned for more. dealer network is vast. proven engine. Only downside i could of is that some people don't like sitting on the rear axle and having a huge hood in front.

lc500 and f-type are more luxury cruisers imo. F types to sound wicked though and look great. still... both are heavy and around 2 tons.

gt350 is a step on from the e9x in every performance metric. but it has its own engine problems. then theres the whole mustang stigma if that matters to you. and its a fairly big car. like gtr size and weight.

they will keep making the supra for at least a few more years. its possible there may be a loaded S58 + manual car weighing 3300-3500 pounds with ceramics and stuff coming under 100k.

edit: oh and don't overlook the C8 and Z06. if the shortages stop GM can pump tens of thousands of these out like previous corvettes. may drop the price to near msrp. even though i don't like how the c8 looks. its a great recipe for a bargain supercar. mid engine + dct + v8.
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      05-02-2022, 06:09 PM   #34
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Weight is about the same
Well it damn sure feels like a heavier car.
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      05-02-2022, 06:21 PM   #35
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Weight of the M2 never ceases to amaze me. How is it so bloody heavy?
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      05-02-2022, 06:30 PM   #36
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OP: the answer in your case is a Lotus Evora GT.
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      05-02-2022, 06:36 PM   #37
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Weight of the M2 never ceases to amaze me. How is it so bloody heavy?
BMW makes cars out of extra heavy Bavarian steel. They've been so busy making SUVs, they just don't care anymore.
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      05-02-2022, 09:13 PM   #38
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steering racks can make a car feel lighter than it is. ferrari/alfa are notorious for making very quick racks. makes the car feel more 'nervous' or light on its feet and eager to turn.

m2 also is cheaper than the m3. so not as much goes into weight saving materials in the body.
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      05-02-2022, 09:15 PM   #39
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by spooni View Post
Weight is about the same
Well it damn sure feels like a heavier car.
Coilovers and forged wheels solves that problem for sure. I think the steering ratio and hydraulic rack of the E9X makes it feel "heavy" too. I didn't enjoy the M2's steering feel. Weird and vague.
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      05-03-2022, 07:06 AM   #40
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OP: the answer in your case is a Lotus Evora GT.
^This
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      05-03-2022, 07:54 AM   #41
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Wow just saw the first 997.2 Carrera S with lowish miles hit over $100K CDN asking price. little under 40,000 miles, manual, sport seats, 4S so all premium stuff but fuck me dead $102??? Remember you need to add 13% tax so that is $115K.

Jesus.
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      05-03-2022, 08:05 AM   #42
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Have you considered a "classic" Porsche? We have a '79 and a '93 and they are fantastic if you want to have some analog fun.
Even with these the prices are going up at a surprising rate.
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      05-03-2022, 10:45 AM   #43
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Quote:
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I've been enamored with the idea of owning a 911 for sometime now. It seems like the natural progression coming from E9X, or a great stablemate.

I drove a 991.1 C2S PDK a few years ago and was left completely underwhelmed. The PDK is nice, but lacks the drama the E9X 7 speed box gives. Very linear power curve but didn't feel fast. This car was for sale at $62k at the time(late 2020), now that same car would be 80. Insane.

Since then I've driven a couple 991s, and a 992 C2S. The only car that gave my willy a tickle was a base C2 manual 991.2. Now with the P car market going to the moon, I don't see the value in these cars with this market(paying retail for a 4-5 year 911 is just madness IMHO).. I've always lusted after the GT cars(mainly the 997 and 991.2 manual), but holy moses, the prices on those have gone MAD.

However, I'm hoping to get into a 991.2 Carrera T manual at some point, realistically in the next 2-3 years. Hoping the values come down a bit. Otherwise I'm looking into a different sports car or GT car for a weekend cruiser, and occasion HPDE companion.

What do y'all think? What would you buy with a $100k budget? Overpriced 911, V8 R8 manual, Aston?
I have 991.2 T in PDK though.
A short test drive will not make you appreciate the value of a 911.

911 = true sports car with ZERO compromises.
It has the perfect seating position, great build quality, reliability, strong brand prestige, huge aftermarket support, huge enthusiast community.
Also things like storage space and rear seats. I fit both my kids in the back with no issues.

Driving these cars is such a pleasure - perfect visibility, suspension doesn’t beat you up, handling is amazing. My car has RAS(rear wheel steer) - i can take the same corners going about 10-20mph more than my F80. No body roll and then you can step on throttle right away as it puts the power down with no issue. The 991.2 cars are easy to mod to get another 100hp with ECU tune. The 3.0 flat 6 is great engine and sounds amazing if u have sport exhaust.

There is really no other sports car in the $100-125k range that i would pick over a used 911.

BTW i have tested most of the competition - MB AMG-GT, AM Vantage, Lexus LC, Audi R8, Maserati GranTurismo. I think the V8s sound great and each of those cars are great in their own way. But if you prefer the total package with direct inputs for steering, throttle, braking, great manual or PDK well then 911 is the only choice.

Last edited by R N M; 05-03-2022 at 10:50 AM..
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      05-03-2022, 10:49 AM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spooni View Post
I've been enamored with the idea of owning a 911 for sometime now. It seems like the natural progression coming from E9X, or a great stablemate.

I drove a 991.1 C2S PDK a few years ago and was left completely underwhelmed. The PDK is nice, but lacks the drama the E9X 7 speed box gives. Very linear power curve but didn't feel fast. This car was for sale at $62k at the time(late 2020), now that same car would be 80. Insane.

Since then I've driven a couple 991s, and a 992 C2S. The only car that gave my willy a tickle was a base C2 manual 991.2. Now with the P car market going to the moon, I don't see the value in these cars with this market(paying retail for a 4-5 year 911 is just madness IMHO).. I've always lusted after the GT cars(mainly the 997 and 991.2 manual), but holy moses, the prices on those have gone MAD.

However, I'm hoping to get into a 991.2 Carrera T manual at some point, realistically in the next 2-3 years. Hoping the values come down a bit. Otherwise I'm looking into a different sports car or GT car for a weekend cruiser, and occasion HPDE companion.

What do y'all think? What would you buy with a $100k budget? Overpriced 911, V8 R8 manual, Aston?
I have 991.2 T in PDK though.
A short test drive will not make you appreciate the value of a 911.

911 = true sports car with ZERO compromises.
It has the perfect seating position, great build quality, reliability, strong brand prestige, huge aftermarket support, huge enthusiast community.
Also things like storage space and rear seats. I fit both my kids in the back with no issues.

Driving these cars is such a pleasure - perfect visibility, suspension doesn’t beat you up, handling is amazing. My car has RAS(rear wheel steer) - i can take the same corners going about 10-20mph more than my F80. No body roll and then you can step on throttle right away as it puts the power down with no issue. The 991.2 cars are easy to mod to get another 100hp with ECU tune. The 3.0 flat 6 is great engine and sounds amazing if u have sport exhaust.

There is really no other sports car in the $100-125k range that i would pick over a used 911.
You're probably right. A few 20 min test drives really can't be enough to grasp the experience of any car really. I passed up a manual T about a year ago, for 91k. Wish I would of just stretched my budget at the time

I still need to go out and drive a few other competitors, but that base manual .2 was the best one I've driven. The trans in that car was sublime! I can only imagine the T taking the up a few notches.
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