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      05-12-2021, 08:32 AM   #45
fiveohwblow
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We looked at

X5
Telluride
Gv80
Rx350
Atlas
GLE 450

And drove nearly all. I will tell you the wife (non car person) didn’t like the materiality of the lesser models and the gauges/instrumentation of the Lexus. To compare the two types isn’t quite appropriate. This is a typical “my underdog is as good as xxxx” story humanity is famous for. At MSRP these cars are where they should be, mostly. I still think the GV80 is punching above it’s acceptable weight as the fit, finish and materials are that of a lesser high end at best. Engines were all lacking comparatively and had turbo 4 a majority of the time or some breathless under 300 Hp v6. The MB we only digitally shopped had a v8 at the same price point and one of the highest towing capacities correspondingly.
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      05-12-2021, 09:14 AM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fiveohwblow View Post
We looked at
The MB we only digitally shopped had a v8 at the same price point and one of the highest towing capacities correspondingly.
You sure you looked at the right one? The GLE 450 has the turbo 6 and the 580 has the v8. The 580 starts at 80k with no options and sits at 86-90k after a few of the common options. That's the same price as a X5m50i and much more expensive than anything else you listed.
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      05-12-2021, 10:34 AM   #47
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Originally Posted by strohw View Post
You sure you looked at the right one? The GLE 450 has the turbo 6 and the 580 has the v8. The 580 starts at 80k with no options and sits at 86-90k after a few of the common options. That's the same price as a X5m50i and much more expensive than anything else you listed.
You’re right and the the 450 starts at 62. I believe I was thinking about the Lexus GX with the v8. May have my engines mixed up but no way were we going backward in towing capacity and power from the turbo inline 6 in our e70. Regardless, point still stands on value for the bucks and Kia motors isn’t quite there yet. Before anyone gets offended, I’m rooting for them. They’ve got AB and the n line is amazing and that’s why we even went and looked. Still too much trade off for us to go that route this time, likely will be much more evenly matched at the next to round.
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      05-12-2021, 10:59 AM   #48
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Originally Posted by JP10 View Post
Disagree with the first paragraph, we've had 7 adults in our telluride and it was comfortable. Passenger volume of the x5 is 103cubic ft, passenger volume of the telluride of 155cubit ft. The x7 has less passenger volume, 143cubic ft.

Anyways, happy I got mine for MSRP - only had to travel close to 700miles each way to do so lmao!
I didn't realize the packaging was so different. The Telluride actually has more leg room than even the previous gen Escalade, which is a much larger vehicle. Although I guess much of that is due to the big V8. The only issue is the 3rd row is still low so your legs aren't at a comfortable angle, even if they aren't jammed into the back of the second row. Can't beat a minivan when it comes to carrying passengers (short of actual passenger vans).

3 row SUV or minivan? I'd opt for fewer passengers
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      05-12-2021, 11:13 AM   #49
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Supply and demand = more profits for dealers willing to ask for a premium. No car is worth a premium over MSRP.
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      05-12-2021, 11:14 AM   #50
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Unless towing, i cannot FATHOM why anyone would do a 3 row SUV over a minivan. I simply do not get it.
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      05-12-2021, 11:37 AM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cfm56d7b View Post
Supply and demand = more profits for dealers willing to ask for a premium. No car is worth a premium over MSRP.
No regular car is even worth MSRP. Even at 10-12% off MSRP, BMWs are still overpriced. Worth the price relative to competitors, though. Going over MSRP on a Kia in a segment with 20 other options is a different story... To me, that's over the 'relative worth' line and into 'absolutely not worth it.'

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Unless towing, i cannot FATHOM why anyone would do a 3 row SUV over a minivan. I simply do not get it.
I've driven 3 row SUVs and minivans. There's not really a difference in driving enjoyment unless we're talking Durango Hellcat. But there's a Pacifica Hellcat in the works, too. As a passenger, minivan wins.

I guess minivans are perceived as boring or lame, but it's not like bus-sized SUVs are lambos... The only (real) 3 row SUV that looks decent to me is the X7.
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      05-12-2021, 11:38 AM   #52
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Originally Posted by Alfisti View Post
Unless towing, i cannot FATHOM why anyone would do a 3 row SUV over a minivan. I simply do not get it.
Hell, not all 3 row SUVs tow any better than minivans. Most of them have to be appropriately equipped to even do that.

And just to throw further confusion on that segment...the BMW 5 Series wagon as well as the Mercedes E Class wagon can tow very nearly as much as the three row SUVs in question (4400-4600 lbs vs. 5000 lbs, braked trailer capacity). Wagons aren't easy to find over here but as far as I know the sedans can do the same.

Ask which I'd rather drive...
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      05-12-2021, 11:54 AM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfisti View Post
Unless towing, i cannot FATHOM why anyone would do a 3 row SUV over a minivan. I simply do not get it.
Aesthetics. My fiance wouldnt be caught dead in a minivan - I think they're bad ass tho haha
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      05-12-2021, 11:55 AM   #54
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Originally Posted by Alfisti View Post
Unless towing, i cannot FATHOM why anyone would do a 3 row SUV over a minivan. I simply do not get it.
Ground clearance. We always get AWD for light off-roading. Only the Pacifica and the Sienna offer AWD but they don't have the ground clearance.

Also, an SUV is like a pair of jeans–you can wear it anywhere: work, garage, camping, church, a nice dinner. It fits.

A minivan is basically cargo shorts.
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      05-12-2021, 12:19 PM   #55
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The minivan has went the way of the station wagon and AFAIK there are only 6 models you can buy now and 2 of them don't even trim that high. So you're left with 4 vehicles if you want an OK trimmed minivan. If you want AWD there are 2. Actually there are less minivan than wagons now.
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      05-12-2021, 12:51 PM   #56
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It's just stigma by upper class white women. That simple.
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      05-12-2021, 01:05 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by strohw View Post
The minivan has went the way of the station wagon and AFAIK there are only 6 models you can buy now and 2 of them don't even trim that high. So you're left with 4 vehicles if you want an OK trimmed minivan. If you want AWD there are 2. Actually there are less minivan than wagons now.
Kia Carnival has entered the chat



Kia is trying to style the minivan to look more like an suv while still being a minivan, I think it doesnt look half bad to be honest, plus its hugely practical after watching a few videos of all the interior arrangements.
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      05-12-2021, 01:10 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfisti View Post
It's just stigma by upper class white women. That simple.
For whatever reason it seems like women seem to hate minivans more than men. When our boys were young I would had no issue getting a minivan for the family vehicle but my wife wanted no part of it.
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      05-12-2021, 01:12 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RMachuca3d View Post
Kia Carnival has entered the chat


Kia is trying to style the minivan to look more like an suv while still being a minivan, I think it doesnt look half bad to be honest, plus its hugely practical after watching a few videos of all the interior arrangements.
This is already in the group I was talking about. It's also in the group that doesn't offer AWD. I do agree that they did a good job with the styling as they actually look better in real life than in that picture.
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      05-12-2021, 01:12 PM   #60
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Originally Posted by heavyD^2 View Post
For whatever reason it seems like women seem to hate minivans more than men. When our boys were young I would had no issue getting a minivan for the family vehicle but my wife wanted no part of it.
Same here, my wife said over a decade ago when we had our first kid..... minivans are what happens when you give up on your own ambitions and loose your individuality as a person, and become a "mother", its funny she said that because she's literally the most dedicated mother to our kids, except when it comes to what she drives .
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      05-12-2021, 01:30 PM   #61
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Oh 100pc it is women, it's completely and utterly irrational so no surprises there i guess. Different....fucking....species.
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      05-12-2021, 01:53 PM   #62
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Wait. So are women also the reason we don't have station wagons in the US? =]
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      05-12-2021, 01:56 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by strohw View Post
Wait. So are women also the reason we don't have station wagons in the US? =]
100pc it is. Seriously. Middle upper class women define trends, they won't be seen dead in a wagon or a minivan but an SUV is cool. Makes absolutely zero sense.
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      05-12-2021, 02:38 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by auburnf30x View Post
Hell, not all 3 row SUVs tow any better than minivans. Most of them have to be appropriately equipped to even do that.

And just to throw further confusion on that segment...the BMW 5 Series wagon as well as the Mercedes E Class wagon can tow very nearly as much as the three row SUVs in question (4400-4600 lbs vs. 5000 lbs, braked trailer capacity). Wagons aren't easy to find over here but as far as I know the sedans can do the same.

Ask which I'd rather drive...
Our former e70 with third row had airbag suspension. And a 6,000 lb towing capacity. It decimated any in its class for the money. Our newer f15 is diesel and with the appropriate hitch, 7,700 lbs. we do tow, but nothing above maybe 3500. Most in the same mid sized suv class that would be the max capacity which would be unwise. As for mini vans, I find them emasculating and ugly as sin. All of them. The right sporty sporty suv offers much more than any van and sadly some sedans. To refute that is ignorance at its finest.

Picture for reference. About 4500 lbs on this trailer.
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      05-12-2021, 02:52 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Merami fan View Post
The Telluride is closer to the X5 than X7... It's 3 inches longer than an X5, but still far from a full-size 3rd row. Telluride vs X5 for nearly the same price? You must be joking. New X5s are still available at 10% off MRSP in some markets. Low 60s with some options. Even lower if you can find a loaner.
The Telluride has a lot more interior space than a X5. Don't get me wrong, a X5 or X7 is different than the Telluride but space wise the Telluride is much closer to a X7 if not a little bigger.
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      05-12-2021, 03:01 PM   #66
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The Telluride is 2.5 inches longer than the X5 but essentially the same dimensions otherwise. The X5 weights a lot more.
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