gabrielle giffords shot

[SonnyJack]

Originally Posted by ybbiz34

Fun at the range. I don't have one, though.

Fun at the range?

I was taught that range time is meant to practice becoming comfortable with your weapon in the form it would be used. Two 17 round standard mags (what you receive with your purchase of the weapon) is more than enough. IMO I can't think of any rational individual who keeps a loaded 33 round magazine around for personal protection.

Range patrons can be sketchy enough as it is. I see some bozo load up an extended mag and I'm gettin the hell out!

[1cleanm6]

ah god rip to the young 9 year old

[molossus]

[Schm]

Classes are delayed until Thursday because Obama is coming to speak. The gobernment is talking about banning high-capacity mags, which in my opinion wont change anything.

Giffords is apparently breathing uneasily and some slight movement in her arms.

[Echo M3]

Originally Posted by scottwww

Correlation may be the wrong word. I was looking for a word that would not imply the studies have concluded there is a direct relationship between marijuana smoking and schizophrenia. Though I believe there to be some relationship. Scientific studies should be the best indicator of what that relationship is and how strong it is. I haven't reviewed the studies. Do you have any data?

http://www.time.com/time/health/arti...5559-1,00.html

Here's a short review article on the subject. The most recent evidence suggests that the relationship is complicated and largely has to do with genetic susceptibility.

In other words, it appears that people who are most likely to get schizophrenia are the ones getting affected by marijuana usage.

[scottwww]

Originally Posted by pman10

http://www.time.com/time/health/arti...5559-1,00.html

Here's a short review article on the subject. The most recent evidence suggests that the relationship is complicated and largely has to do with genetic susceptibility.

In other words, it appears that people who are most likely to get schizophrenia are the ones getting affected by marijuana usage.

That's kind of a fascinating little article with no real conclusion. So, it appears that it depends on what study you consider. Funny how the two stories linked after page one of the article are

See photos of the great American pot smoke-out.
Read about how to grow medical marijuana.


Some notes:

"the sensitive group started smoking pot at a younger age — before age 17, compared with 18 in patients without marijuana sensitivity"

"Although the disease itself affects only 1% of the population, about 10% of healthy people have personality features that, when intensified, may characterize schizophrenia — such as paranoia — meaning that the proportion of the population who may be sensitive to marijuana could be larger than expected, Krebs says."

"the mood-lifting effect of marijuana was stronger among smokers with schizophrenia."

The information described about this study is hard to swallow:

"in people with schizophrenia... who smoked marijuana had faster brain processing speed, greater verbal ability and better memory than patients who didn't smoke"

Although they did qualify it as possibly the worst schizophenics just didn't have the ability to function to go out and buy marijuana.

And then this:

"the bulk of negative marijuana-related effects appear later on, as an increased rate of hallucination that affects patients even when they are not high."

And finally this:

"One chemical called delta-9 tetrahydocannabinol (THC) is known to cause hallucinations and in high doses can even make healthy people feel paranoid or suffer brief attacks of psychosis. But another component of marijuana called cannabidiol (CBD) has anti-psychotic effects."

Isn't it true that growers have done all they can to develop marijuana strains that maximize THC and minimize CBD production? And also, they monitor the crop so as to harvest when THC will be at high levels and CBD at relatively lower levels?

Probably each study would be interesting reading itself, and with so many different results and theories, to read one would not qualify as a reasoned perspective.

How much did Giffords shooter smoke?

[Tondtar]

^ ^ ^

I really think you are preaching to the choir here, Scott

[Schm]

Originally Posted by scottwww

How much did Giffords shooter smoke?

Not sure, but I think that for however much he did smoke, there are people out there who smoke a lot more and haven't gone on a shooting rampage. In my opinion, it's very difficult to draw a definite causal relationship between marijuana and Mr. Laughtners actions.

Also, in other news, the Westboro Baptist Church has stated their intention to protest at the funeral of several of the victims of the shooting, including the 9 year old. Arizona quickly passed a law preventing anyone from protesting closer than 300 feet from a funeral.

http://www.abc15.com/dpp/news/state/...son-protestors

[ScaredOnce]

Originally Posted by JayKay335i

Everybody and their mother has a gun here in AZ. They walk around with them stuffed in their shorts and shit all day. I find that most of these people appear to be irresponsible morons. I wish there were actual gun laws.

Does that make you uncomfortable? Would would you prefer to be British? I think Canada might be an option.

Originally Posted by shockin330i

Lol, crimals don't obey laws.

Let me put it in Jared Loughner's terms.

Criminals carry guns
Criminals don't follow Government Laws.

Government makes a law banning guns..
Criminals don't follow Government Laws..

Thus Criminals carry guns.

This is it. The current firearms laws on the books are already preemting much Federal law, including the Constitution. More firearms laws are pointless and usually illegal themselves - not to mention unenforceable.

Originally Posted by JayKay335i

Or you live in a place where if you are carrying a gun, you are a criminal. I great up with if you carry a gun you are either a cop or a criminal. Out here everybody and their mother has a gun. I think it should be something you earn, not a god given right.

Um. You might be in the wrong country. It is a right, as it should be. You don't need to do anything to purchase firearms legally, other than pay the seller. The carry application process in a lot of states are illegal themselves. Open carry is legal without a LTCF, CCW Permit, etc everywhere (except Fed property/Post Offices/Court Rooms (not court houses - your courthouse MUST provide you with a locker to secure your sidearm at the courthouse. A lot of courthouses are breaking this law.)

Originally Posted by ybbiz34

I'm unfamiliar with the Arizona handgun laws but I think they allow something along the lines of "Constitutional Carry." I'm not sure if an Arizona citizen still has to obtain a permit in order to carry a handgun.

I'm a big Second Amendment supporter. I strongly believe that an individual should be able to carry a weapon in order to protect themselves, friends, and loved ones in the event that the need arises. I also think that carrying a weapon also comes with great responsibility.

In Indiana, for instance, I had to submit an application for a license to carry a handgun to the Indiana State Police Dept. (which took 8-12 weeks). I was fingerprinted, they ran a background check, and I had an interview with my local Police Chief. Indiana allows for both concealed and "open" carry.

I just know that personally, I feel MUCH safer with responsible, upstanding, and armed citizens walking around than without them, leaving the criminals to have their way. The police can't be everywhere.

My .02 cents.

Bold above is mine. Great responsibility - absolutely.

When seconds count, the police are minutes away. An armed society is a polite society. I'm sorry that you had to deal with an illegal application process to enjoy your 2nd Amendment rights. That's BS. PM me for info on how to help change that. We've done well in PA.

Originally Posted by CollinsE90

since when does a Glock have 31 rounds in a clip?

MAGAZINE! If you figure out a way to put a "clip" in a Glock... lol Sorry, just a pet peeve of mine. If you have an M1 Garand, you will be using CLIPS. Your favorite polymer-framed, DOA, striker-fired hand cannon from Austria in fact uses magazines. sorry... had to. it's like a twitch! lol

Originally Posted by SonnyJack

Standard Glock 19 magazine holds 15 rounds although you can get the 17 round version (campact holds 13). Extended magazines used to be illegal but the law was allowed to lapse so you can now get the 33 round version. No need for a 33 round magazine that I can think of. Sometimes the laws just don't make sense.

Yeah he planned to kill everyone he could.

Um.... High capacity mags are normal everywhere except Cali. Standard G19 mags may be something like 15 rounds I think. But, it's not uncommon to carry (especially leaving in the car) a much higher capacity mag. My .40s&w hicaps for my XDs I think hold 22rds, but if you bend the mag lips slightly, 30 9mm will fit easy.

Originally Posted by SonnyJack

Fun at the range?

I was taught that range time is meant to practice becoming comfortable with your weapon in the form it would be used. Two 17 round standard mags (what you receive with your purchase of the weapon) is more than enough. IMO I can't think of any rational individual who keeps a loaded 33 round magazine around for personal protection.

Range patrons can be sketchy enough as it is. I see some bozo load up an extended mag and I'm gettin the hell out!

LOL... find a better range.

I'm glad that you mentioned being "taught". Training and safety are number one. But, please don't lump us responsible firearms enthusiasts and those who are self defense minded as irrational just because we have some hi-cap mags loaded around the house/car/wherever.

Do you have fire extinguishers/smoke alarms in your house?

-=-

Most people who carry firearms daily are by no means dangerous nor criminals. It's just a cute thing to latch onto while your gov't continues to disarm you. This event was a tragedy, let's not make it even easier for it to happen again and again by laying down our arms. Don't be one of the sheeple.

[ScaredOnce]

Originally Posted by Schm

Not sure, but I think that for however much he did smoke, there are people out there who smoke a lot more and haven't gone on a shooting rampage. In my opinion, it's very difficult to draw a definite causal relationship between marajuana and Mr. Laughtners actions.

Also, in other news, the Westboro Baptist Church has stated their intention to protest at the funeral of several of the victims of the shooting, including the 9 year old. Arizona quickly passed a law preventing anyone from protesting closer than 300 feet from a funeral.

http://www.abc15.com/dpp/news/state/...son-protestors

The Westboro Baptist fools are about the only time that I could come close to fathoming the irresponsible use of firearms. These pieces of shit actually protest and parade around at the funerals of fallen armed forces members - as it is their right to do so. Welcome to freedom. (still might someday think of punching one... tasteless fools)

[ghosthi32]

alright mr. NRA

[ScaredOnce]

Originally Posted by ghosthi32

alright mr. NRA

ooo... Don't lump me in with those guys. The NRA is a hugely compromising organization. Some would say that they do more harm to Pro-2A people than good.

Plus, I don't have any firearms in my possession. All lost in a terrible canoeing accident... very sad.

[molossus]

Originally Posted by ScaredOnce

ooo... Don't lump me in with those guys. The NRA is a hugely compromising organization. Some would say that they do more harm to Pro-2A people than good.

Plus, I don't have any firearms in my possession. All lost in a terrible canoeing accident... very sad.

hey thats how I lost my guns too.

[SonnyJack]

Originally Posted by ScaredOnce

MAGAZINE! If you figure out a way to put a "clip" in a Glock... lol Sorry, just a pet peeve of mine. If you have an M1 Garand, you will be using magazines. Your favorite polymer-framed, DOA, striker-fired hand cannon from Austria in fact uses magazines. sorry... had to. it's like a twitch! lol

Do you have fire extinguishers/smoke alarms in your house?

Most people who carry firearms daily are by no means dangerous nor criminals. It's just a cute thing to latch onto while your gov't continues to disarm you. This event was a tragedy, let's not make it even easier for it to happen again and again by laying down our arms. Don't be one of the sheeple.

I'm with you on the clip/mag thing but you got a bit too fired up. You meant to say CLIPS for the top loading M1 Garand, not magazines.

I do have extinguishers in my house but I don't see the need to double or triple the number just to feel safe.

Agree that most gun owners are normal people, and that criminals will always find a way to arm themselves. However, we need to figure out a way to keep guns away from mentally unstable people before another of these events occurs.

[Schm]

Anyone watch the speech tonight? A bit more of a rally than a memorial, but still pretty good nonetheless. Pretty cool when Obama said how she opened her eyes. Good shit.