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      01-15-2020, 02:42 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by A6bullet View Post
Thanks, America, for killing the car.
All the people that bought X models were free to pick any vehicle they wanted.

The consumer is choosing SUV and manufacturers have to respond or go out of business.

What kind of business focuses on products consumers don't want?

A very very small niche manufacturer.
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      01-15-2020, 02:54 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by heavyD^2 View Post
It's North America in general as Canadians are turning to SUV's as well. I've been a car guy my entire life as my 2020 X3M is the first SUV or truck I've owned in almost 30 years of driving but I can understand why the general population likes these things at least in my part of the world where there's a lot of snow and the roads are crap. That said even a tricked out SUV like X3M does not replace a well sorted car when it comes to driving pleasure so I will still be buying cars in the future.
My father recently got a Macan S after driving sedans his entire life. The Boxster/Cayman were too difficult for him to get in and out of and the Panamera is too expensive. Macan is all that was left from Porsche at a reasonable price point. It drives well for a CUV but definitely not as fun as a car that sits lower.

I wish they'd make a mid-size sedan slotted below the Panamera.
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      01-15-2020, 03:35 PM   #25
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My father recently got a Macan S after driving sedans his entire life. The Boxster/Cayman were too difficult for him to get in and out of and the Panamera is too expensive. Macan is all that was left from Porsche at a reasonable price point. It drives well for a CUV but definitely not as fun as a car that sits lower.

I wish they'd make a mid-size sedan slotted below the Panamera.
I wish the same
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      01-15-2020, 04:32 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A6bullet View Post
Thanks, America, for killing the car.
The SUV is what saved Porsche from bankruptcy. Sacrilege I say! But now, you look at Bentley and Lamborghini offering one. So is Ferrari next?
And from a pure automotive economic standpoint, you gotta give the people what they want. Ride or die.
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      01-15-2020, 07:45 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by heavyD^2 View Post
Which is impressive considering as the X7 (solid first year) didn't really cannibalize any sales from the lower models.
X sales in 2019 showed only 449 units more than in record 2016 (no X7), while 52K+ sales of the X7 were in 2019.

The X7 did cannibalize sales from lower X models.
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      01-16-2020, 02:53 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by Ristau View Post
I think he physically means "car" vs "SUV" (sorry BMW, not calling it an SAV lol). SUVs are selling well, especially in North America, which is killing cars (mainly sedans) as daily drivers.
Thanks yes, I meant killing off sedans and such.
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      01-16-2020, 04:58 AM   #29
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The first year of the X7 is impressive.
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      01-16-2020, 09:11 AM   #30
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I see it. I use to dislike SUV's, then kids came 9yrs ago. Then I started to age, sore lower back, roadtrips, sports gear and now I don't ever see myself in a car again for a daily driver. I really hate getting in and out of my wife's 3 series - and I think we'll replace her 3 series with a SUV in a year or two. She doesn't like sitting low in a world of tall vehicles. Thank you BMW for making a great X5 and X7.
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      01-16-2020, 04:59 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Germanauto View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by heavyD^2 View Post
It's North America in general as Canadians are turning to SUV's as well. I've been a car guy my entire life as my 2020 X3M is the first SUV or truck I've owned in almost 30 years of driving but I can understand why the general population likes these things at least in my part of the world where there's a lot of snow and the roads are crap. That said even a tricked out SUV like X3M does not replace a well sorted car when it comes to driving pleasure so I will still be buying cars in the future.
My father recently got a Macan S after driving sedans his entire life. The Boxster/Cayman were too difficult for him to get in and out of and the Panamera is too expensive. Macan is all that was left from Porsche at a reasonable price point. It drives well for a CUV but definitely not as fun as a car that sits lower.

I wish they'd make a mid-size sedan slotted below the Panamera.
IIRC, Porsche did plan a mid-size sedan to compete with the 5/E/A6. Since it has not come to fruition, maybe Porsche saw the decline of car sales and shelved it? It's a shame, I think such a product, priced from 60-90k, would have been a good seller for Porsche.
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      01-16-2020, 06:16 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpine300zhp View Post
IIRC, Porsche did plan a mid-size sedan to compete with the 5/E/A6. Since it has not come to fruition, maybe Porsche saw the decline of car sales and shelved it? It's a shame, I think such a product, priced from 60-90k, would have been a good seller for Porsche.
Yeah I remember early in the decade seeing reports of Porsche developing a sub-Panamera "Pajun." There were even spy shots. I'm unsure if Porsche was really planning for a "Pajun" or those plans were for the Taycan all along.

A mid-sized Porsche sedan starting in the $60-80k range would have been the perfect car for me. That segment is profitable for competitors, I don't understand why Porsche won't enter it.
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      01-16-2020, 06:19 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Germanauto View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpine300zhp View Post
IIRC, Porsche did plan a mid-size sedan to compete with the 5/E/A6. Since it has not come to fruition, maybe Porsche saw the decline of car sales and shelved it? It's a shame, I think such a product, priced from 60-90k, would have been a good seller for Porsche.
Yeah I remember early in the decade seeing reports of Porsche developing a sub-Panamera "Pajun." There were even spy shots. I'm unsure if Porsche was really planning for a "Pajun" or those plans were for the Taycan all along.

BMW, Mercedes, and Audi sell a ton of their mid sized executive cars. A mid-sized Porsche sedan started in the $60-80k range would have been the perfect car for me.
You are correct. It was called the Pajun(I forgot the name until you mentioned it). You may be correct about that car being the concept Taycan OR perhaps the Pajun was scrapped and replaced with the Taycan when Porsche saw electric cars taking off..... As for why Porsche won't get into that category, I too am baffled. I think such a Porsche would do well if Porsche had the guts to make it.
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