The Airplane Thread

[vreihen16]

Originally Posted by BMWGUYinCO

I love this site - it's cool to see Airbus A380s flying again!

My home ADS-B receiver usually has 1-3 in range at any given time, since I live in the great circle path between Europe and NYC, Philly, DC, Atlanta, and Chicago.....

[3.0L]

Originally Posted by Llarry

The competition between Grumman and Vought in the mid- to late-1940s had been won by Vought with their F4U Corsair, which became plentiful aboard Navy carriers after World War II (see above post.) But jet fighters were the next big thing and all the manufacturers were anxious to get contracts to provide the Navy and Marine Corps with jets. Vought was a traditional and preferred supplier but its F6U (not pictured) turned out to be a disappointment.

Reliable Grumman designed a jet fighter around the Rolls-Royce Nene jet, which was license-built by Pratt & Whitney as the J42. The resulting F9F-2 Panther first flew in 1947 and appeared to show promise. But all the early jets required extensive development to become useful carrier fighters.

There was a new entrant in the competition, though; McDonnell had designed the first Navy jet fighter, the FH-1 (1st photo), which first flew in prototype form in 1945 and had been built in very limited numbers.

McDonnell built upon that early experience with a greatly improved aircraft designated the F2H Banshee. The F2H first flew in 1947 and by 1950 had entered service as the F2H-2 with Navy and Marine fighter squadrons. The F2H-2 used twin Westinghouse J30 jet engines buried in the wing roots and was equipped with the new ejection seat for the pilot.

The Grumman F9F-2 had entered service slightly ahead of the F2H. When the Korean war started in mid-1950, several carriers each had a single F9F fighter squadron aboard (as well as several F4U Corsair squadrons). The F9F-2 was soon joined in combat over Korea by F2H-2 Banshee squadrons. As the war progressed, carriers embarked two jet fighter squadrons each.

A comparison between the F9F-2 and the F2H-2 reveals that both aircraft had about the same turn of speed -- 575 mph or 925 kmh -- and both were initially armed with four 20mm cannon. Both airplanes were soon capable of dropping bombs and firing rockets as well, although the Banshee had a larger bomb capacity. The F2H also had a superior ceiling; although both aircraft were adapted to use as unarmed photo aircraft, the Banshee excelled in the photo recon role.

Both companies developed improved versions, but only Grumman's F9F-5 saw combat in Korea. The F9F-5 Panther had larger tail surfaces and an uprated P&W J48 engine. When just comparing production numbers of these early Navy carrier day fighters, Grumman came out on top, building 1,385 F9F Panthers of all types. McDonnell was a distant second with 308 F2H-2s built.

Post-script: The competition went on for several more years. Grumman modified the F9F Panther with swept wings for better speed and the result was the F9F-6 Cougar, which was a transonic aircraft.
McDonnell went in another direction, lengthening the F2H to increase fuel capacity and adding radar. This transformed the resulting F2H-3 into the first widely used night/all-weather carrier fighter used by Navy and Marine squadrons (and later by the Royal Canadian Navy). The F2H-3 was also capable of carrying a nuclear bomb.

Both the Cougar and the Banshee managed to survive into the 1960s; the Cougar as an advanced trainer and the later Banshees in Navy Reserve squadrons.

I just bought an F9F-8 Cougar RC electric ducted fan jet. It has retractable landing gear and flaps. Flies super nice and even sounds like a jet.

[ezaircon4jc]

Originally Posted by BMWGUYinCO

I love this site - it's cool to see Airbus A380s flying again!

You never had to work around one...

[Llarry]

I'm Llarry and I'm a Bearcatoholic.

Maybe I need an intervention...

[Llarry]

The governments of Canada and the United States have reached an agreement this date for the purchase of 14 P-8A Poseidon patrol aircraft by Canada, with options for two additional aircraft. These aircraft will be operated by two wings of the RCAF on both coasts.

Deliveries of the aircraft (Canadian designation not yet known) will be at the rate of one per month and should be complete by 2027.

[Llarry]

Germany is planning to buy 15 electronic combat Typhoons to replace aging Luftwaffe Tornado ECRs. The new aircraft should be introduced by 2030.

[sukutash]

Originally Posted by Llarry

The governments of Canada and the United States have reached an agreement this date for the purchase of 14 P-8A Poseidon patrol aircraft to Canada, with options for two additional aircraft. These aircraft will be operated by two wings of the RCAF on both coasts.

Deliveries of the aircraft (Canadian designation not yet known) will be at the rate of one per month and should be complete by 2027.

Canada can pick 1 of these up at a HUGE discount from the U.S. Navy right now! It's also conveniently located just off the runway in Hawaii.

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...ater-in-hawaii

[Llarry]

Originally Posted by sukutash

Canada can pick 1 of these up at a HUGE discount from the U.S. Navy right now! It's also conveniently located just off the runway in Hawaii.

That P-8A has already been emptied of fuel. I was surprised to hear some naval aviators speculate that the airplane will fly again. That's an awful lot of salt water to survive.

The other thing I gleaned from the naval aviators' forum is that the P-8A landed on a seldom-used shorter runway.

[ezaircon4jc]

Originally Posted by Llarry

...
The other thing I gleaned from the naval aviators' forum is that the P-8A landed on a seldom-used shorter runway.

I was working SLC tower when Western got their first 737-300's. One came in one day and the pilot asked me how long was the diagonal runway (32 at the time). I said 5400' (why do I remember that?) and he said the book says that was long enough and he asked me if he could use that runway. I said absolutely, and cleared him to land. After his abrupt stop at the end, he asked me to do a favor for him. I said sure and he said.... DON'T EVER LET ME LAND ON THAT RUNWAY AGAIN!!

[Llarry]

The Vietnam war spurred all sorts of innovation. One area of concern was monitoring the Ho Chi Minh trail that North Vietnam used to transport supplies to the Viet Cong in the South.

Among the U.S. efforts to monitor the traffic on the trail was a U.S. Army aircraft designed by Lockheed's Skunk Works to be so quiet that it could fly a thousand feet over the heads of the enemy without being detected. Lockheed greatly modified a Schweizer glider into a very quiet aircraft, the YO-3A Quiet Star. The YO-3A did not fly until 1969 and was only used operationally in 1970-71. 11 were built and most wore camouflage paint and served in Southeast Asia.

The crews found that the YO-3A was so quiet that they could fly down to treetop level without being detected. None of the YO-3As were hit by enemy fire during the war.

After the war, the YO-3As were used by NASA and various law enforcement organizations.

The photos depict two different propellors; the NASA one has a conventional-appearing three-blade prop, whereas it appears that a six-blade prop was used during the war.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_YO-3_Quiet Star

[Llarry]

The world's first aircraft carrier-based torpedo plane was a UK design. Sopwith designed a single-place relatively large biplane to carry a heavy torpedo for ship attacks: The Sopwith Cuckoo first flew in 1917 and entered RAF service in 1918. The Royal Navy had plans to attack the German fleet in their home waters, but the end of World War I overtook that scheme.

The Cuckoo had a major disadvantage for carrier operations: It could not land back aboard ship! It would have to ditch in the sea or seek a
friendly airfield once launched from the carrier. Despite this issue, the Cuckoo remained in RAF service until 1923.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sopwith_Cuckoo

[M-technik-3]

Who got caught loading a UFO on a C5 in the daylight?



lol

Crazy Canadians and their Avrocar. VZ-9

[JJ 911SC]

Originally Posted by M-technik-3

... Crazy Canadians and their Avrocar. VZ-9

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avro_Canada_VZ-9_Avrocar

[3.0L]

Originally Posted by Llarry

The Vietnam war spurred all sorts of innovation. One area of concern was monitoring the Ho Chi Minh trail that North Vietnam used to transport supplies to the Viet Cong in the South.

Among the U.S. efforts to monitor the traffic on the trail was a U.S. Army aircraft designed by Lockheed's Skunk Works to be so quiet that it could fly a thousand feet over the heads of the enemy without being detected. Lockheed greatly modified a Schweizer glider into a very quiet aircraft, the YO-3A Quiet Star. The YO-3A did not fly until 1969 and was only used operationally in 1970-71. 11 were built and most wore camouflage paint and served in Southeast Asia.

The crews found that the YO-3A was so quiet that they could fly down to treetop level without being detected. None of the YO-3As were hit by enemy fire during the war.

After the war, the YO-3As were used by NASA and various law enforcement organizations.

The photos depict two different propellors; the NASA one has a conventional-appearing three-blade prop, whereas it appears that a six-blade prop was used during the war.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_YO-3_Quiet Star

Meanwhile, my 5 man team watched the VC and NVA move along the Ho Chi Minh Trail near the Cambodian border with our mobile AN/TPS-25 ground surveillance radar. We adjusted artillery fire onto the infiltrators just after they crossed the border. 99% of the action was at night. We'd detect 2 to 6 targets a night on average. Head count usually ranged from 20 to 40, but sometimes more, all spaced out in a long, well-disciplined line. We did this for 12 months while living like rats in bunkers you couldn't stand up in. The radar incorporated dopler, so we could actually hear the difference between moving troops and the wind blowing vegetation. We were usually based at small FSB's just a few miles from the border.

[vreihen16]

https://www.reuters.com/business/aer...on-2023-12-01/

Exclusive: Boeing eliminated from US Air Force's 'Doomsday Plane' competition

WASHINGTON, Dec 1 (Reuters) - The U.S. Air Force has eliminated Boeing (BA.N) from its competition to develop a successor to the E-4B Nightwatch, Boeing confirmed on Friday, shaking up the battle to build the next version of the aircraft known as the "Doomsday Plane" due to its ability to survive a nuclear war.

The move leaves privately-held defense contractor Sierra Nevada Corp as the lone company publicly vying for the Survivable Airborne Operations Center (SAOC) contract to eventually replace a fleet that has been in use since the 1970s.....

[Llarry]

Originally Posted by 3.0L

Meanwhile, my 5 man team watched the VC and NVA move along the Ho Chi Minh Trail near the Cambodian border with our mobile AN/TPS-25 ground surveillance radar. We adjusted artillery fire onto the infiltrators just after they crossed the border. 99% of the action was at night. We'd detect 2 to 6 targets a night on average. Head count usually ranged from 20 to 40, but sometimes more, all spaced out in a long, well-disciplined line. We did this for 12 months while living like rats in bunkers you couldn't stand up in. The radar incorporated dopler, so we could actually hear the difference between moving troops and the wind blowing vegetation. We were usually based at small FSB's just a few miles from the border.

That sounds like a potentially dangerous position to be in. How far were you from the Trail?

[flybigjet]

Originally Posted by M-technik-3

Who got caught loading a UFO on a C5 in the daylight?

That's my old squadron.... 312th Airlift Squadron out of Travis AFB, CA.

You can tell by the patch on the loadsmasher's shoulder.

I spent over 20 years with that crowd and more than a couple of wars and deployments-- they're Good People.

R.

[Llarry]

Preparations for the use of the F-16 by the Ukrainian Air Force continue. Instructor pilots are being trained in Romania in preparation for the training of Ukrainian fighter pilots and in October, a small number of Ukrainian pilots started training with the U.S. Air National Guard 162nd Fighter Wing in Tucson, Arizona.

The hope is that the first Ukrainian pilots will be combat ready in 2024.

The Romanian Air Force itself is getting additional F-16AMs and BMs from Norway, adding to the squadron's worth purchased from Portugal some years ago. This should allow Romania to retire its last MiG-21s and have an all-F-16 fighter force; their proximity to the hostilities in Ukraine is no doubt making them nervous.

[M-technik-3]

I hope that Putin will come to some sense of reality and realize this battle is a giant waste of time and resources for his country. Just look at the SBU unit that just sabotaged the China-Russia rail tunnel. No more supplies coming that way soon.

[Llarry]

I've previously posted about the U.S. Navy's adversary squadrons -- the equivalent of the Air Force's aggressor squadrons. Here are some fresh photos of F-18Es of the VFC-12 'Fighting Omars' based at the Naval Air Station Oceana, Virginia, near Norfolk. VFC-12 is a reservist unit with a mix of reserve and active duty pilots and provides adversary services for the Atlantic strike fighter squadrons.

Ideally, an adversary unit should fly a dissimilar aircraft but in this case I suppose the Super Hornets were available.

Note the Chinese national markings on the tail of aircraft number 06.

[3.0L]

Originally Posted by Llarry

That sounds like a potentially dangerous position to be in. How far were you from the Trail?

We were as close as 4 miles from the Cambodian border. Our mobile ground surveillance radar had a maximum range of 8 miles but due to terrain and foliage, we rarely could detect movement beyond 5 miles. The fire support bases we stayed at typically were about 300 feet in diameter and contained a Howitzer battery (usually six 105's) and a company of infantry. At the time I was there, Cambodia was off-limits, so even though we could detect movement just across the border, we had to wait until they crossed the border. They did shoot rockets at us from across the border. Crazy war.

[Llarry]

Here's an aircraft with a rather unusual appearance: A modified Dash-7 belonging to Transport Canada and used for environmental surveillance and to monitor illegal fishing activities, etc.

The Dash-7 was built by De Havilland Canada as the DHC-7, now known as Viking Air.