Are Manual Transmission BMWs Really a Dying Breed?

[speeddeacon]

Originally Posted by Ramos

Sorry if this was already mentioned but I didn't read all 8 pages..

The proof that the MT BMW is on it's way out in the US market is that MT is now a no cost option whereas we used to have to pay extra for the Auto.
The financial incentive of the MT is gone, the performance and efficiency advantage of the MT is gone. The only benefit that remains is the fun/involvement factor.
It's only a matter of time.

For the M3/M4 DCT is a $2900 option.

Financial incentive- $0
Performance and efficiency- $0
Fun/involvement- PRICELESS!

[BIGW0RM]

I'm so thankful I found a 2013 6MT before they were all gone! I don't miss my 2011 DCT one bit. Love you long time 6MT!

[LuisBoston]

Originally Posted by burnand

The electric car revolution will be the final nail.... Luckily we have a few years left

amen. it's the primary reason I bought my 128i 6mt 2013. It will be a classic in 15-20 years. I plan to keep her forever.

[Jeef]

Didn't read all pages but everyone complaining probably can't even drive their car to its full potential anyway...

[WilliCO]

The reality is that the manual transmission these days is kind of a lifestyle choice. People want it because of the experience it adds to driving the car. I get that, and I have enjoyed driving the MT cars I have owned.

Having said that, the current batch of automatics simply perform better. You give up no speed advantage with them, shifts are made much faster than any mortal can make with an MT, and the torque converters interfere imperceptibly with the transfer of power from crank to wheel. Or not at all, with the dual clutch manual-automatics. And, well, you don't have to shift yourself.

Here's what I might say - if I were to buy a BMW or a Porsche with the intent of pushing it down the road for 150,000 miles, I might still prefer a clutch simply to avoid the expense of maintaining such an advanced automatic transmission once it begins to age. But, on the other hand, in a lease I can't imagine the business case for a manual to be strong enough to compel me.

But that is just me.

[3M TAPE]

I am so SICK and TIRED of driving manuals, I hope manuals go away forever:

1. I constantly have to use my left foot (I am lazy)
2. I constantly have to use my right hand (very tiring, especially after I masturbate)
3. I have to engage parking brake (side brake) every freaking time I park
4. I constantly have to think which gear is the best to save fuel or for the engine
5. I constantly have to think about not making a money shift
6. Every corner I have to worry about where/when is the best braking point.
7. Every corner it makes me want to attack
8. Every corner it makes me want to heel-and-toe

I can go on forever..

[flavius]

Originally Posted by WJGreer

The reality is that the manual transmission these days is kind of a lifestyle choice. People want it because of the experience it adds to driving the car.

I have driven manuals for twenty years. No more for me.

[E85BMW]

Originally Posted by Double Bubble

I am so SICK and TIRED of driving manuals, I hope manuals go away forever:

1. I constantly have to use my left foot (I am lazy)
2. I constantly have to use my right hand (very tiring, especially after I masturbate)
3. I have to engage parking brake (side brake) every freaking time I park
4. I constantly have to think which gear is the best to save fuel or for the engine
5. Every corner I have to worry about where/when is the best braking point.
6. Every corner it makes me want to attack
7. Every corner it makes me want to heel-and-toe

Are you too lazy to walk around also, or do you hop around on your right foot then?

[Ramos]

Did you really miss the sarcasm in his post????

[E85BMW]

I guess I did, haha.

[Mr Kleen]

The biggest mistake I made when ordering my 135i was getting the DCT.
I won't make that same mistake again.

[ezmaass]

Manual transmissions are doomed. It's a technology of yesteryear. For technology to live on, it typically needs to have some tangible benefit aside from nostalgia. When modern automatics are faster, more efficient, and more effective at their goal, it's a hard argument to keep manuals around.

Yes, it's engaging to drive a manual - you're working harder to drive the car, and hence that feels somehow psychologically more engaging. But try convincing a Formula 1 driver that paddles can't be engaging, fun, or useful. Taking a hand off the wheel to shift gears seems all but primitive today... and at great speed, downright dangerous. Is it no surprise then that you can't buy a Ferrari today with a manual either?

This article makes it sound as if BMW stands alone - they don't. Many of the world's leading brands have kept manuals around for the die-hard fans, but that fan-base is shrinking. Most drivers in their 20's and 30's today haven't even driven a manual. And that statistic will continue to be emphasized as time goes on. No different than generations growing up today who don't know a rotary telephone or crank windows!

Some people just don't like change. Taking away their ability to row gears may be akin to chopping off a leg... driving won't be "natural" to them any longer. But that's life. How many times throughout history have we heard arguments in the auto industry about obsolete technology and why things just won't ever be the same any longer? Too many to count. Granted, the MT is a staple of sports cars, but the stats in orders don't lie... even with the M3, the majority of orders were for DCTs.

I won't mourn the death of the MT. It'll have its place in our automotive history, but I'd much prefer a more effective, faster, and efficient technology that carries the industry forward versus looking backwards at how things were. For some that'll be harder to give up.

[BKsBimmer]

Originally Posted by damnitBobby

one of the main reasons my future car will be an M4 is because of the manual transmission option

the fact that mercedes or lexus do not offer manual transmission gives a BIG advantage to bmw

I'm hoping you're on to something and I hope BMW get's it. While I do believe MT will continue to be phased out for most models I can see the MT option becoming a strong niche market for enthusiast drivers of cars like BMW and Porsche. Unfortunately that would probably also mean it would eventually become an expensive option.

[BMW269]

So as I see, many like manual, yet are to lazy to downshift, so prefer turbo for instant torque.

[WilliCO]

Originally Posted by BKsBimmer

I'm hoping you're on to something and I hope BMW get's it. While I do believe MT will continue to be phased out for most models I can see the MT option becoming a strong niche market for enthusiast drivers of cars like BMW and Porsche. Unfortunately that would probably also mean it would eventually become an expensive option.

Actually, Porsche is phasing out manual transmissions (source) and Ferrari no longer offers them at all.

I think MTs are one of those things where the fans are vocal, but at this time a tiny minority. Apparently the take rate on the MT for the last Ferrari model that offered one was 1%.

[Falafel Combo]

Originally Posted by WJGreer

Actually, Porsche is phasing out manual transmissions (source) and Ferrari no longer offers them at all.

I think MTs are one of those things where the fans are vocal, but at this time a tiny minority. Apparently the take rate on the MT for the last Ferrari model that offered one was 1%.

Modern day autos and DCT just lay down the rubber better. Just like AWD vs RWD. With more horsepower, the case for AWD becomes stronger. Yet you will still find that some prefer the driving dynamics of a high output RWD, fully knowing that it may be 0.1 or 0.2 seconds slower to 60. Performance numbers and driving experience are two different things.


Also, last time I checked, Porsche and Ferrari do not make family sedans and wagons so they can afford to do that.

[WilliCO]

Originally Posted by alpinweiss 335i

Modern day autos and DCT just lay down the rubber better. Just like AWD vs RWD. With more horsepower, the case for AWD becomes stronger. Yet you will still find that some prefer the driving dynamics of a high output RWD, fully knowing that it may be 0.1 or 0.2 seconds slower to 60. Performance numbers and driving experience are two different things.

I agree, that's exactly what I said in post 181 above.

Originally Posted by alpinweiss 335i

Also, last time I checked, Porsche and Ferrari do not make family sedans and wagons so they can afford to do that.

I'm not making the connection here. You're saying that since BMW makes wagons, we should expect them to continue to offer a manual transmission?

[E85BMW]

I honestly believe that the day I no longer have use of my left leg is the day that I make the switch to the dark side. There's just so much enjoyment in driving a vehicle with a manual transmission.

I love the fact that you are in control with how the car is driven. Yes, you can pull a paddle and downshift and the car will always rev-match perfectly, but to me, that takes all the fun and skill from it.

I get more satisfaction with knowing that I'm involved in the process of the downshift, I'm the one pushing down on the clutch pedal, seperating the plates, choosing the gear, and knowing how much pressure to press down on the gas pedal before I ease back on the clutch. The biggest satisfaction comes with finishing the downshift and hearing the engine without any interruptions through the transition, as if to signal that the operation was a complete success. As if the car is telling you, 'Yes, you're doing it right.'

And that's just one thing you can't get with an automatic.

[templarklimek]

It almost seems at times in order to advocate the superiority of the DCT/Auto crowd they must denigrate and destroy the manual crowd. The DCT even auto's now out shift a human, that isn't in question. BUT, isn't a sports car about the pleasure of driving? Some of us prefer the visceral aspect of shifting our own gears, to be plugged into and part of the car. The central nexus if you will. What else should we yield to the machine? How about steering or braking? If the computer can use GPS and cameras/lidar to do it faster and better than you than let it? No. IMHO I have no issue with manuals becoming a pay for option like a convertible. But if they remove the choice I will no longer have a need for a "sports car". A tepid SUV will do just fine. I special ordered my 2014 with a manual and it's a blast, my M235 is on the way with same setup. I'm trading in a 2013 X6M for the little M235 as the X6M while powerful lacks any connection for me. I'm just steering and pushing the gas pedal.

Again, I'm a sports car enthusiast and applaud the tech of the DCT, but to each his own.

[lmendz71]

Here's my opinion.
Luxury cars= automatic transmission
Sports car= manual transmission.
It's better to own both but manual is just so much fun to drive if you can rev 7000rpm.

[StickMon]

I'd be bored to death without my 6MT.
To me, it's not a real sports car without a manual, but then, I'm old.

[mweine]

I dont buy new BMWs any more because they stopped selling AWD with 6MT.