Kaepernick and the National Anthem

[Delta0311]

Originally Posted by ScottSinger

John Legend called the 'Star Spangled Banner' a weak song in defense of Kaepernick. For the first time in my life I listened to Legend on iTunes...Legend's crap is totally unlistenable.

His songs suck and are written at about a 5th grade level.

[phrozen06]

Why don't we just sing the original version Francis Scott Key intended? You know part where it glorifies killing slaves for fighting on the British side. Lets just go all in and see it sung at ever sports event and every session of congress both federal and state.

[Delta0311]

Originally Posted by phrozen06

Why don't we just sing the original version Francis Scott Key intended? You know part where it glorifies killing slaves for fighting on the British side. Lets just go all in and see it sung at ever sports event and every session of congress both federal and state.

Better idea, why don't we take the cops out of all inner cities and let the thugs do their thing. Just form a perimeter around the cities and make it like something out of Escape From New York.

[kprocivic]

Originally Posted by Delta0311

Better idea, why don't we take the cops out of all inner cities and let the thugs do their thing. Just form a perimeter around the cities and make it like something out of Escape From New York.

That was a terrible reference. The original song did glorify killing slaves that were fighting for their freedom with the British.

[overcoil]

Originally Posted by kprocivic

That was a terrible reference. The original song did glorify killing slaves that were fighting for their freedom with the British.

Though by the time Jimi Hendrix played and Whitney Houston sung, had not the original tune from the 1770's or there about, coalesced into a picturesque ballad?
Is there not a redeeming quality that any reference to killing or slavery was never a part of the song when it was nationally recognized as an anthem?

[kprocivic]

Originally Posted by ScottSinger

Though by the time Jimi Hendrix played and Whitney Houston sung, had not the original tune from the 1770's or there about, coalesced into a picturesque ballad?
Is there not a redeeming quality that any reference to killing or slavery was never a part of the song when it was nationally recognized as an anthem?

No problem at all. But like a ton of problems with society now, Noone addresses these facts. Or people think they never happened.

[Delta0311]

Originally Posted by kprocivic

That was a terrible reference. The original song did glorify killing slaves that were fighting for their freedom with the British.

And how many people living in the US are slaves today?

[kprocivic]

Originally Posted by Delta0311

And how many people living in the US are slaves today?

I'm not sure but let's acknowledge it happened. Lol that's it

[Haywood]

I actually think God Bless America is a better anthem.

[larryn]

Originally Posted by ScottSinger

Though by the time Jimi Hendrix played and Whitney Houston sung, had not the original tune from the 1770's or there about, coalesced into a picturesque ballad?
Is there not a redeeming quality that any reference to killing or slavery was never a part of the song when it was nationally recognized as an anthem?

The original tune was meant to honor a battle, and was witten in 1814 as a poem by Francis Scott Key as "The Defence of Fort Henry", which occurred during the War of 1812. Nearly a hundred years later, the poem was placed over a British melody (not unlike "My Country Tis of Thee" and "God Save the Queen") - not a lot of originality, obviously. Although it has been sung as in all four versus, the Star Spangled Banner is noted to be the first verse of the poem.

So, although the poem had one line in it about slavery, it was never meant as a national anthem and certainly not a national anthem about killing slaves. Here is a picture of the original printing of the poem. I suggest you read it for yourselves - and think of what else was happening at the time:


The reference to "hireling and slave" is interesting, because folks that "worked for the company store" in mines and to work crops were not considered slaves, but are treated the same in this poem. They were viewed as owing "the boss" and could not just flee without repercussions of death. Sad time in history, for sure, but that was 203 years ago when that poem was written, and not as our national anthem.

[kprocivic]

i can read just fine

And where is that band who so vauntingly swore,
That the havoc of war and the battle’s confusion
A home and a Country should leave us no more?
Their blood has wash’d out their foul footstep’s pollution.
No refuge could save the hireling and slave
From the terror of flight or the gloom of the grave,
And the star-spangled banner in triumph doth wave
O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave.

[larryn]

Originally Posted by kprocivic

i can read just fine

And where is that band who so vauntingly swore,
That the havoc of war and the battle’s confusion
A home and a Country should leave us no more?
Their blood has wash’d out their foul footstep’s pollution.
No refuge could save the hireling and slave
From the terror of flight or the gloom of the grave,
And the star-spangled banner in triumph doth wave
O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave.

No kidding? Congratulations. Did you also read that was not written as a national anthem and that the song was never adopted with that stanza, or that it was not specific to slaves and that it is also regarding workers for material reward (company store men)?

It is not a valid argument that those 2 lines were ever part of our national anthem.

[Delta0311]

Originally Posted by larryn

No kidding? Congratulations. Did you also read that was not written as a national anthem and that the song was never adopted with that stanza, or that it was not specific to slaves and that it is also regarding workers for material reward (company store men)?

It is not a valid argument that those 2 lines were ever part of our national anthem.

Exactly most anthems are written as songs about a specific conflict. The writer is not writing it going "gee this will be or anthem in the future."

Here is part of the Polish National anthem that's happens to be cut out. Yes it's part of the original song but not part of the anthem.
The German nor the Muscovite will settle
When, with a backsword in hand,
"Concord" will be everybody's watchword
And so will be our fatherland.

Well we are not running around hacking up Germans and Russians now are we ?

[overcoil]

Originally Posted by larryn

The original tune was meant to honor a battle, and was witten in 1814 as a poem by Francis Scott Key as "The Defence of Fort Henry", which occurred during the War of 1812. Nearly a hundred years later, the poem was placed over a British melody (not unlike "My Country Tis of Thee" and "God Save the Queen") - not a lot of originality, obviously. Although it has been sung as in all four versus, the Star Spangled Banner is noted to be the first verse of the poem.

So, although the poem had one line in it about slavery, it was never meant as a national anthem and certainly not a national anthem about killing slaves. Here is a picture of the original printing of the poem. I suggest you read it for yourselves - and think of what else was happening at the time:


The reference to "hireling and slave" is interesting, because folks that "worked for the company store" in mines and to work crops were not considered slaves, but are treated the same in this poem. They were viewed as owing "the boss" and could not just flee without repercussions of death. Sad time in history, for sure, but that was 203 years ago when that poem was written, and not as our national anthem.

No. the original TUNE was written earlier with lyrics that were about a Greek poet.
Key, used the TUNE (as many others have) and wrote the lyrics themed on Fort McHenry.

http://www.newyorker.com/culture/cul...pangled-banner

[larryn]

Originally Posted by ScottSinger

No. the original TUNE was written earlier with lyrics that were about a Greek poet.
Key, used the TUNE (as many others have) and wrote the lyrics themed on Fort McHenry.

http://www.newyorker.com/culture/cul...pangled-banner

I said that the tune was added later, but NEVER mentioned when that tune was done - I did educate that it was a British tune that already existed. So, not sure why I'm wrong there... Key wrote the poem about a battle he witnessed, as I also said. He did not put the tune to it. The mating of the poem and the tune were done later and not by Key. Also, again, it was not written as a slve song, national anthem or anything of the sort. It was anout a battle. Presumably, Scott witnessed both slaves and hirelings (company men) using the battle as an opportunity to flee preceived debt.

Thanks for filling in a piece that the tune was from earlier. It was actually named "To Anacreon in Heaven" and was first heard in 1791 in London in a music based gentlemen's club.

[phrozen06]

Originally Posted by Delta0311

And how many people living in the US are slaves today?

[Delta0311]

Originally Posted by phrozen06

Here is an idea. Don't get involved in a life of crime when you know you can't afford a decent lawyer. Now if you choose to be stupid and your court appointed attorney is a moron, well that's on you.

[overcoil]

Originally Posted by larryn

I said that the tune was added later, but NEVER mentioned when that tune was done - I did educate that it was a British tune that already existed. So, not sure why I'm wrong there... Key wrote the poem about a battle he witnessed, as I also said. He did not put the tune to it. The mating of the poem and the tune were done later and not by Key. Also, again, it was not written as a slve song, national anthem or anything of the sort. It was anout a battle. Presumably, Scott witnessed both slaves and hirelings (company men) using the battle as an opportunity to flee preceived debt.

Thanks for filling in a piece that the tune was from earlier. It was actually named "To Anacreon in Heaven" and was first heard in 1791 in London in a music based gentlemen's club.

My fault, I'm a little ADD and have no idea why I tried correcting you.

[phrozen06]

Originally Posted by phrozen06

Why don't we just sing the original version Francis Scott Key intended? You know part where it glorifies killing slaves for fighting on the British side. Lets just go all in and see it sung at ever sports event and every session of congress both federal and state.

Originally Posted by Delta0311

Better idea, why don't we take the cops out of all inner cities and let the thugs do their thing. Just form a perimeter around the cities and make it like something out of Escape From New York.

Are you going to answer my question first? Why don't we sing the original version?

[phrozen06]

Originally Posted by Delta0311

Here is an idea. Don't get involved in a life of crime when you know you can't afford a decent lawyer. Now if you choose to be stupid and your court appointed attorney is a moron, well that's on you.

So what you're saying is that crime does pay only when you're wealthy, that law enforcement and the court system isn't even handed with dealing with it's citizens?

[infamousdiz]

Originally Posted by Delta0311

Here is an idea. Don't get involved in a life of crime when you know you can't afford a decent lawyer. Now if you choose to be stupid and your court appointed attorney is a moron, well that's on you.

Mandatory minimums for crack but not cocaine, the system is rigged for wealthy and you have a better chance with a lower sentencing being white vs a minority. If you do real research you will find the system failing the mentally ill, drug addicts ect. It's sad and because it's big business the cycle never stops.......DEA is worthless.

[imserious]

Originally Posted by f80lul

Is this more embarrassing or his hair? I can't decide.