F1 2024: Italian GP - Imola (May 19)

[Killed by Death]

U already jinxed me with hammy, Toto is all I need

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by Marcoose

Two words will forever define the 2021 season: Michael Masi.

Two words ?

469 laps.

[Artemis]

It's raining cats and dogs in Northern Italy.

Imola should be OK this Friday and Saturday, but thunderstorms are expected for the race this Sunday (race start scheduled at 3pm local time).

[TheStoka]

Originally Posted by Artemis

It's raining cats and dogs in Northern Italy.

I think its safe to say it will be less wet than last year....

Maybe them hideous spray guards that Ferrari tested would be useful.

[Marcoose]

Originally Posted by Artemis

Two words ?

469 laps.

Right. Let’s then recap the 2021 Abu Dhabi GP.

- Lewis Hamilton led for 51 laps
- Sergio Pérez led for 6 laps
- Max Verstappen led for 1 lap

Conclusion: Hamilton was entitled to win. Thank you. I rest my case. Again.

[Killed by Death]

Originally Posted by Marcoose

Right. Let’s then recap the 2021 Abu Dhabi GP.

- Lewis Hamilton led for 51 laps
- Sergio Pérez led for 6 laps
- Max Verstappen led for 1 lap

Conclusion: Hamilton was entitled to win. Thank you. I rest my case. Again.

Hammy didn't lead the most important lap did he

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by Marcoose

Right. Let’s then recap the 2021 Abu Dhabi GP.

- Lewis Hamilton led for 51 laps
- Sergio Pérez led for 6 laps
- Max Verstappen led for 1 lap

Conclusion: Hamilton was entitled to win. Thank you. I rest my case. Again.

Let's agree to disagree: Verstappen has deservedly won the 2021 WDC, including the 2021 Abu Dhabi race.

A couple of 2021 F1 stats about Verstappen:

• most championship points
• most victories
• most podiums
• most pole positions
• most laps in the lead
• most 'fastest lap of the race'
• either P1 or P2 in every 2021 race, except:
  • Hungary: P9 (crash caused by Bottas/Mercedes in lap 1/70)
  • Azerbaijan: DNF (blown tire | P1 in lap 46/51 | had fastest lap but got no point for it because of DNF)
  • Silverstone: DNF (crash with Hamilton/Mercedes | P1 in lap 1/52)
  • Monza: DNF (crash with Hamilton/Mercedes | P8 in lap 26/53 | had fastest lap but got no point for it because of DNF)

Ahead of the 2021 Abu Dhabi race, in response to concerns, race director Michael Masi himself warned that Verstappen or Hamilton could be subject to further sanctions from the FIA if one of them decided to manufacture a deliberate race-ending collision in an attempt to engineer a favourable championship result, up to and including championship disqualification or future race bans:

• "FIA issues points deduction warning ahead of F1 title decider"
  https://www.the-race.com/formula-1/f...title-decider/
• "Tensions rise between Lewis Hamilton and Max Verstappen before F1 decider"
  https://www.theguardian.com/sport/20...ore-f1-decider

That same race director - condemning prior to the race any attempt to engineer a favourable championship result - took a decision during the final stage of the 2021 Abu Dhabi race. It wasn't Verstappen who has taken that race decision (just like Verstappen hasn't taken the "No further action" decision when Hamilton gained a track position and exit speed advantage by cutting the Turn 9 hairpin during the first lap of the race).

Despite its excellent skills and vast experience, Mercedes decided not to pit Hamilton for soft tires during the safety car stage resulting from the Latifi crash. And additionally, despite his excellent skills and vast experience, Hamilton misjudged Verstappen during the notorious final lap: race leader Hamilton, fully aware that he was tailgated by Verstappen in the final lap, left a considerably big gap on his left side upon Turn 5 approach: Hamilton must have assumed that Verstappen had planned an overtake attempt at a later turn. But Verstappen struck straightaway: he went for the gap and outsmarted his 7xWDC main rival in Turn 5 in a proper, WDC title worthy, way. Hamilton's Turn 5 exit speed was compromised. The end.

Mercedes appealed the 2021 Abu Dhabi final lap race decision. FIA dismissed the appeal. Mercedes has rest its case. Hamilton has rest his case.

It's your choice to allow Verstappen and/or Masi to keep on living rent free in your head because of the 2021 Abu Dhabi race. The 2021 F1 season consisted of 22 races and 3 Sprint events. It's 2024 now, about time to move on, Marcoose.

By the way, two more words defining the 2021 F1 season:

Silverstone Heist.

[TheStoka]

Originally Posted by Marcoose

Two words will forever define the 2021 season: Michael Masi.

Originally Posted by Artemis

By the way, two more words defining the 2021 F1 season:
Silverstone Heist.

Can we just agree that 2021 was a great season regardless of which side of the RB/Merc camp you sit on?
The most memorable season of that era of cars for me. Full of chaos, think there was many moments where the championship battle could have changed if the outcome was tiny bit different.

My personal favourite Bottas playing snooker at Hungary and cleaning up both RB’s and Norris in the process. Ocon having the field part like he’s Moses.
Hamilton brake magic lockup in Baku
Ver parking it ontop of Ham clearing the way for an Mcl 1-2 and Ric win.
Russel giving Bottas a whack after that crash in Imola
Norris chucking away a P1 in the wet in Russia
Leclerc taking pole in front of the tfosi then ending in the wall unable to start the next day
Jeddah Ver Q3 purples then into the wall, Ham hitting Ver in race trying to give the place back.
Just the ones that come to mind!

[NYG]

History is so convenient when we can hyperfocus on one race and forget that Max was crashed out by a pathetic and desperate driver at Silverstone, crashed out by their teammate in Hungary and still finished 9th with one side of their barge board missing, etc... It's almost like he would have clinched the championship before Abu Dhabi.

I get it Lewis fans, you've been struggling to accept that maybe your boy isn't the greatest of all time and that Max is very obviously a superior driver top to bottom. Every record Max breaks, it gets harder and harder to cope with it. All that's left now is "muh championships" because Max has dominated almost every other metric.

Bringing up 2021 in every thread and every page makes it even more desperate.

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by Killed by Death

Hammy didn't lead the most important lap did he

I think it was in the 2019 Monaco GP ...

MAX finally got his first opportunity to attack LEW !
MAX moved up to P2 , but he received a 5 sec. penalty for an unsafe pit release demoting him to P4 .

Yeah LEW : It was 'that guy !

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by TheStoka

Can we just agree that 2021 was a great season regardless of which side of the RB/Merc camp you sit on?
The most memorable season of that era of cars for me. Full of chaos, think there was many moments where the championship battle could have changed if the outcome was tiny bit different.

My personal favourite Bottas playing snooker at Hungary and cleaning up both RB’s and Norris in the process. Ocon having the field part like he’s Moses.
Hamilton brake magic lockup in Baku
Ver parking it ontop of Ham clearing the way for an Mcl 1-2 and Ric win.
Russel giving Bottas a whack after that crash in Imola
Norris chucking away a P1 in the wet in Russia
Leclerc taking pole in front of the tfosi then ending in the wall unable to start the next day
Jeddah Ver Q3 purples then into the wall, Ham hitting Ver in race trying to give the place back.
Just the ones that come to mind!

Great post mate !

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by NYG

History is so convenient when we can hyperfocus on one race and forget that Max was crashed out by a pathetic and desperate driver at Silverstone, crashed out by their teammate in Hungary and still finished 9th with one side of their barge board missing, etc... It's almost like he would have clinched the championship before Abu Dhabi.

I get it Lewis fans, you've been struggling to accept that maybe your boy isn't the greatest of all time and that Max is very obviously a superior driver top to bottom. Every record Max breaks, it gets harder and harder to cope with it. All that's left now is "muh championships" because Max has dominated almost every other metric.

Bringing up 2021 in every thread and every page makes it even more desperate.

Absolutely , spot on !

It was one of LEW's dirty tricks at Silverstone in the Copse turn , it was actually like a murder attempt !
Close up snapshot from MAX's helmet . Check this out ! 180mph - 51G crash

[NYG]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

Absolutely , spot on !

It was one of LEW's dirty tricks at Silverstone in the Copse turn , it was actually like a murder attempt !
Close up snapshot from MAX's helmet . Check this out !

It was Michael Masi's fault!!!

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by NYG

It was Michael Masi's fault!!!

That's too funny my friend !

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by TheStoka

Can we just agree that 2021 was a great season regardless of which side of the RB/Merc camp you sit on?
The most memorable season of that era of cars for me. Full of chaos, think there was many moments where the championship battle could have changed if the outcome was tiny bit different.

My personal favourite Bottas playing snooker at Hungary and cleaning up both RB’s and Norris in the process. Ocon having the field part like he’s Moses.
Hamilton brake magic lockup in Baku
Ver parking it ontop of Ham clearing the way for an Mcl 1-2 and Ric win.
Russel giving Bottas a whack after that crash in Imola
Norris chucking away a P1 in the wet in Russia
Leclerc taking pole in front of the tfosi then ending in the wall unable to start the next day
Jeddah Ver Q3 purples then into the wall, Ham hitting Ver in race trying to give the place back.
Just the ones that come to mind!

The 2021 F1 season was exceptionally exciting.

As commented in the past:

Originally Posted by Artemis

All the bickering is to no avail. The past is the past, this is now.

We got the benefit that in a decade or so, we can all say that we have witnessed the rivalry on tracks between Hamilton and Verstappen.

Some food for thought. Hamilton has indisputably a monumental race career featuring countless trophies, titles and records. One of the greatest F1 drivers ever. However, despite all that greatness, excellence and vast experience, there happens to be a dude 12 years his junior who keeps stopping him in his tracks to win even 1 single race or Sprint ever since passing the chequered flag during the 2021 Saudi Arabia F1 race (Dec 5, 2021). It's that same rascal, time and time again.

Now, to be capable to stop a force of nature, Hamilton the man himself, takes either extreme luck or super talent, or both.

Hamilton is ultra in F1. But ever since the 2021 Abu Dhabi F1 race (Dec 12, 2021), Verstappen consistently shows being nec plus ultra in F1. And that could be Verstappen's real claim to fame in the future, regardless of all trophies, titles and records that he will have collected by then: "I raced against Hamilton - The Man, The Legend - and ended his P1 era".

Brief review: "F1 2021: An Unforgettable Season" (shown during the F1 2021 awards ceremony) (08:06):

Extended review: "The Eight And One - Verstappen vs Hamilton F1 2021 Season Review" (1:23:47):

[Killed by Death]

Originally Posted by Artemis

Let's agree to disagree: Verstappen has deservedly won the 2021 WDC, including the 2021 Abu Dhabi race.

A couple of 2021 F1 stats about Verstappen:

• most championship points
• most victories
• most podiums
• most pole positions
• most laps in the lead
• most 'fastest lap of the race'
• either P1 or P2 in every 2021 race, except:
  • Hungary: P9 (crash caused by Bottas/Mercedes in lap 1/70)
  • Azerbaijan: DNF (blown tire | P1 in lap 46/51 | had fastest lap but got no point for it because of DNF)
  • Silverstone: DNF (crash with Hamilton/Mercedes | P1 in lap 1/52)
  • Monza: DNF (crash with Hamilton/Mercedes | P8 in lap 26/53 | had fastest lap but got no point for it because of DNF)

Ahead of the 2021 Abu Dhabi race, in response to concerns, race director Michael Masi himself warned that Verstappen or Hamilton could be subject to further sanctions from the FIA if one of them decided to manufacture a deliberate race-ending collision in an attempt to engineer a favourable championship result, up to and including championship disqualification or future race bans:

• "FIA issues points deduction warning ahead of F1 title decider"
  https://www.the-race.com/formula-1/f...title-decider/
• "Tensions rise between Lewis Hamilton and Max Verstappen before F1 decider"
  https://www.theguardian.com/sport/20...ore-f1-decider

That same race director - condemning prior to the race any attempt to engineer a favourable championship result - took a decision during the final stage of the 2021 Abu Dhabi race. It wasn't Verstappen who has taken that race decision (just like Verstappen hasn't taken the "No further action" decision when Hamilton gained a track position and exit speed advantage by cutting the Turn 9 hairpin during the first lap of the race).

Despite its excellent skills and vast experience, Mercedes decided not to pit Hamilton for soft tires during the safety car stage resulting from the Latifi crash. And additionally, despite his excellent skills and vast experience, Hamilton misjudged Verstappen during the notorious final lap: race leader Hamilton, fully aware that he was tailgated by Verstappen in the final lap, left a considerably big gap on his left side upon Turn 5 approach: Hamilton must have assumed that Verstappen had planned an overtake attempt at a later turn. But Verstappen struck straightaway: he went for the gap and outsmarted his 7xWDC main rival in Turn 5 in a proper, WDC title worthy, way. Hamilton's Turn 5 exit speed was compromised. The end.

Mercedes appealed the 2021 Abu Dhabi final lap race decision. FIA dismissed the appeal. Mercedes has rest its case. Hamilton has rest his case.

It's your choice to allow Verstappen and/or Masi to keep on living rent free in your head because of the 2021 Abu Dhabi race. The 2021 F1 season consisted of 22 races and 3 Sprint events. It's 2024 now, about time to move on, Marcoose.

By the way, two more words defining the 2021 F1 season:

Silverstone Heist.

Attachment 3458708

Originally Posted by TheStoka

Can we just agree that 2021 was a great season regardless of which side of the RB/Merc camp you sit on?
The most memorable season of that era of cars for me. Full of chaos, think there was many moments where the championship battle could have changed if the outcome was tiny bit different.

My personal favourite Bottas playing snooker at Hungary and cleaning up both RB’s and Norris in the process. Ocon having the field part like he’s Moses.
Hamilton brake magic lockup in Baku
Ver parking it ontop of Ham clearing the way for an Mcl 1-2 and Ric win.
Russel giving Bottas a whack after that crash in Imola
Norris chucking away a P1 in the wet in Russia
Leclerc taking pole in front of the tfosi then ending in the wall unable to start the next day
Jeddah Ver Q3 purples then into the wall, Ham hitting Ver in race trying to give the place back.
Just the ones that come to mind!

Brilliant

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by Killed by Death

Hammy didn't lead the most important lap did he

Originally Posted by TheStoka

Can we just agree that 2021 was a great season regardless of which side of the RB/Merc camp you sit on?
Jeddah Ver Q3 purples then into the wall

It's great to witness race drivers giving it all they got.

F1 1988 Monaco GP

Qualies: Senna was operating on a different level:

Senna (P1 - McLaren Honda) 1.427s clear of Prost (P2 - McLaren Honda), 2.687s clear of Berger (P3 - Ferrari) and 3.299s clear of Alboreto (P4 - Ferrari):



Race: Senna was comfortably leading the race. His race engineer told him to slow down. But Senna didn't settle for the race win, no, he was determined to also lap his main rival and team mate Prost to show his dominance.

Race leader Senna crashed in lap 66/67 out of 78, squandering the 9 race win points. Prost won the race, getting the 9 race win points. Nevertheless, Senna managed to get the WDC that season (90 points). P2 for Prost (87 points).

[3798j]

.

[Killed by Death]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

Well mate ...We can feel your pain .

[Killed by Death]

[Innovade]

Originally Posted by NYG

History is so convenient when we can hyperfocus on one race and forget that Max was crashed out by a pathetic and desperate driver at Silverstone, crashed out by their teammate in Hungary and still finished 9th with one side of their barge board missing, etc... It's almost like he would have clinched the championship before Abu Dhabi.

I get it Lewis fans, you've been struggling to accept that maybe your boy isn't the greatest of all time and that Max is very obviously a superior driver top to bottom. Every record Max breaks, it gets harder and harder to cope with it. All that's left now is "muh championships" because Max has dominated almost every other metric.

Bringing up 2021 in every thread and every page makes it even more desperate.

The only reason why Max can dominate in such a way is because there's never been such a perfect storm to allow this to happen. Talented driver with the fastest car on the grid and a cost cap that basically prevents anyone from catching up. This isn't a slight against Verstappen either, it's just how things are.

Redbull is also operationally doing the right thing to secure WDC and WCC to pair Max with a driver that they know cannot challenge Max. Redbull has zero interest in fielding two competitive drivers. They've seen what happened with Mercedes (who've historically had no issues with fielding two of the best drivers on the grid). They want someone who can reliably place right behind Max. Max is obviously a great and talented driver, but Redbull/Jos would not allow for a 2nd driver that challenges him.

Max has never had a strong teammate. Danny (who was good, but didn't do much), Gasly (GP2 champ), Albon, and Checo. Meanwhile, Lewis has had the strongest teammates out of any driver possibly ever: Alonso (beat Schumacher back-to-back for WDC), Button (WDC driver), Rosberg (WDC driver), Bottas (GP3 champ), and now Russell (F2, GP3 champ).

Personally, I think they're doing his legacy a disservice even though Redbull is doing the right thing to secure championships. When comparing the greatest drivers, Max will undoubtedly come up and someone will immediately say a rebuttal with the fact that he's never had to fight a teammate for the championship. People will immediately see these as default championships because of an OP car and a second-rate teammate. Of course, Max can only beat what's in front of him and it's unfair to think this way, but the reality is that this is an important factor to benchmark a driver.

[Killed by Death]

Originally Posted by Innovade

The only reason why Max can dominate in such a way is because there's never been such a perfect storm to allow this to happen. Talented driver with the fastest car on the grid and a cost cap that basically prevents anyone from catching up.

It's ABSOLUTELY happened before....Hamilton

Talented driver with the fastest car on the grid and an engine freeze that basically prevented anyone from catching up.