Still want an EV? (NO POLITICS)

[Car-Addicted]

Cold Snap: EV Owners Face Reduced Range, Longer Charging Times
01/17/2024
Model Range Lost Below Freezing
2021-2022 Audi E-Tron 16%
2019 Nissan Leaf 23%
Tesla Model 3 Long Range 24%
Tesla Model X 100D 24%
Tesla Model Y Long Range AWD 24%
2022-2023 Ford F-150 Lightning Extended Range 26%
Tesla Model S 90D 28%
2021 Ford Mustang Mach-E Premium AWD Extended Range 34%
2020-2021 Hyundai Kona Electric 34%
2015 Nissan Leaf 34%
2017-2022 Chevy Bolt 42%
2021 Volkswagen ID.4 46%

https://www.kbb.com/car-news/cold-sn...harging-times/

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by dfox

Only a concern to someone who hasn't experienced EV's.

One, they're opt-in programs. Two, they have overrides for the times you absolutely need to charge right now. Third, with an EV, you almost never drive the thing down to nothing. I have never seen single digit %'s on my car. I charge any time the battery gets below 30%. It just requires a little planning and forethought but hey, I never have to stop at a gas station. And if some surprise comes up, I just take one of my other two ICE vehicles... It's really nice living in the middle and not forcing myself to either end of the extremes...

Ah, um, well, this just just um... seems incongruous.

[gonzo]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

Ah, um, well, this just just um... seems incongruous.

[dfox]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

Ah, um, well, this just just um... seems incongruous.

no need to be obtuse. Or maybe you're just thick? boring day to day driving requires no gas stations. I drive a total of about 12k miles a year with 9k of those miles on the EV... 3/4 of my driving requires zero time at a gas station.

[dfox]

Originally Posted by Car-Addicted

You don't have a clue on what "Managed electric vehicle (EV) charging" is do you?
Here is an official government source so that should work for you.

https://www.energy.gov/femp/managed-...hicle-charging
https://www.nrel.gov/transportation/...-charging.html

Management of increased demand for electricity without the need for additional investment in traditional power grid infrastructure is known as "non-wire" solutions.
Charging Load Estimation
Estimation of regional charging loads distributes charging more evenly across the grid, thereby reducing peak generation needs, and ensuring safe and reliable charging for all.
Control Adjustment
Adjustment of controls maintains grid reliability during extreme weather events.
Equitable Electric Vehicle Adoption
Using tools, such as the EV Infrastructure for Equity Model, helps develop smart-charge management algorithms that support more equitable and just EV adoption and infrastructure deployment.
I especially like the "equitable and just EV adoption"

I'll requote myself just because you seemed to diliberatly delete and ignore that part of my post...

One, they're opt-in programs. Two, they have overrides for the times you absolutely need to charge right now.

[Car-Addicted]

Originally Posted by dfox

I'll requote myself just because you seemed to diliberatly delete and ignore that part of my post...

So to paraphrase, you have no idea what "Managed electric vehicle (EV) charging" is.

[eugenebmw]

Albertans have given a frosty reception to EV sales.

1. EVs would use up 100 km worth of electricity in 15 min
2. EVs dead in the snow. Tow of a very heavy vehicle EV and the wait could take up to 5 days currently

Time to wake up

https://edmontonsun.com/opinion/lett...-frosty-to-evs

[RM7]

Well there are plenty here in Alaska, all kinds of Teslas, been that way for years. Now I'm seeing the Hyundais and Kias as the 2nd most common, they seemed to have entered the market hard and seriously, vs. some of the others that are half-a$$ing it. There's plenty of other random stuff in small numbers, Taycans, Rivians, BMWs, etc., but the Teslas and Koreans are in pretty large numbers and out there every day, driving around, big time since about 8 years or so. Got friends that race the M3P at the track and they do pretty damn good, it's a different dynamic...not better or worse, but different.

[dfox]

Originally Posted by Car-Addicted

So to paraphrase, you have no idea what "Managed electric vehicle (EV) charging" is.

It's not about understanding what those programs are, I sure do. It's about recognizing that they're optional, which you seem to have a hard time comprehending.

It's an optional program offered to EV owners. There are ZERO required managed EV charging systems out there. There are some programs out there with incentives for EV owners to opt into but it's not mandatory. If an EV owner wants that for themselves, they can opt in for it. If they don't want it, they don't have to.

I'm really not sure what you fail to grasp about that concept, and why you feel the need to be intentionally obtuse about it.

Similarly there are programs out there that give incentives to let utilities control your thermostat... If you don't want that, you just don't sign up for it.... That simple.

[M5Rick]

I heard there's another slightly newer design Tesla being made, maybe this one has built in sprinklers to extinguish battery fire before it takes hold.

[Car-Addicted]

This Is the Biggest Problem With EV Adoption | WSJ

[Car-Addicted]

Originally Posted by dfox

Treating EVs as a Group and Individually

Grid operators can use EV aggregation to collectively control the charging of large numbers of EVs. Determining how much power should flow from the grid to aggregated EVs is not as simple as adding up each individual EV's charging capacity. This is because an EV can be plugged in but already fully charged, so it could be assigned charging from the aggregate that it cannot fulfill. This can lead to unrealistic estimates of how much charging aggregated EVs can accept. Inaccurate estimates impact the grid's ability to meet all power demands in the most efficient and cost-effective way. So operators need a way to send charging signals that can be disaggregated to fit individual EV capabilities.
https://www.nrel.gov/news/program/20...-charging.html

Bottom line is you can't opt out. If there is a issue with the power available on the grid you lose.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by Car-Addicted

This Is the Biggest Problem With EV Adoption | WSJ

That was a very well done video. Thanks for posting.

I've been keeping up with the Polar Vortex (fancy for "Cold Snap") charging issue and winter driving issues over on an EV forum. What a cluster f. Why anyone would buy a $50K EV just to add this much hassle to their life has me completely befuddled. Last night driving home from my office after my H3T cold soaked all day in 15 deg. F, I was pondering about the Great Polar Vortex EV Fiasco of 2024 and amusing myself thinking how privileged I am driving a truck all toasty inside with a GM small block under the hood.

This whole EV thing is a joke.

[KRS_SN]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

I heard there's another slightly newer design Tesla being made, maybe this one has built in sprinklers to extinguish battery fire before it takes hold.

Next feature gigaexcrementerator (in tesla speak)...when the owner neds to shit himself when no chargers work/are available.

[Murf the Surf]

Originally Posted by RM7

Well there are plenty here in Alaska, all kinds of Teslas, been that way for years. Now I'm seeing the Hyundais and Kias as the 2nd most common, they seemed to have entered the market hard and seriously, vs. some of the others that are half-a$$ing it. There's plenty of other random stuff in small numbers, Taycans, Rivians, BMWs, etc., but the Teslas and Koreans are in pretty large numbers and out there every day, driving around, big time since about 8 years or so. Got friends that race the M3P at the track and they do pretty damn good, it's a different dynamic...not better or worse, but different.

Clearly Alaska gets winter as does Chicago and Saskatchewan. You are clearly a fan of Tesla and I guess you've figured it out and it works for you, but this video illustrates the challenges that will happen if mass adaption or mandated adaption happens. A great deal of NA experiences these cold temperatures in winter, some will suggest it's usually not long term, maybe only 20 or 30 days a year. But as more and more people make the change these challenges will get much worse.

[gblansten]

I continue to enjoy my EV. A buddy of mine in Minnesota continues to love his EV. Saw a post on Twitter from a lady with a multi-EV household in Colorado that loves their EVs.

Chicago has very few level 3 chargers. It is certainly something to work on. Also people need to precondition their batteries on the way to a supercharger. It is easy to do.

Finally, for those having their 12 volt batteries die in the cold. That is definitely a thing. I had that happen to my ICE in the dead of winter years ago. The 12 volt batteries don't last forever and when they do die on you it does suck.

[gblansten]

This is the view of EVs presented in this thread:

https://www.reddit.com/media?url=htt...7eb49393670fe8

It is just as realistic.

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by KRS_SN

Next feature gigaexcrementerator (in tesla speak)...when the owner neds to shit himself when no chargers work/are available.

Certainly incontinence pads would come into their own in such circumstances.

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by gblansten

This is the view of EVs presented in this thread:

https://www.reddit.com/media?url=htt...7eb49393670fe8

It is just as realistic.

Nice try but just nope.

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by Car-Addicted

This Is the Biggest Problem With EV Adoption | WSJ

...and that's just in sunny warm Los Angeles.

[Murf the Surf]

Originally Posted by gblansten

I continue to enjoy my EV. A buddy of mine in Minnesota continues to love his EV. Saw a post on Twitter from a lady with a multi-EV household in Colorado that loves their EVs.

Chicago has very few level 3 chargers. It is certainly something to work on. Also people need to precondition their batteries on the way to a supercharger. It is easy to do.

Finally, for those having their 12 volt batteries die in the cold. That is definitely a thing. I had that happen to my ICE in the dead of winter years ago. The 12 volt batteries don't last forever and when they do die on you it does suck.

Again, you might find your EV fits your needs and works for you and your friends. The theme that seems to be prevalent and that you are dismissing is that EV's clearly aren't a one size fits all for the masses.

[Murf the Surf]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

...and that's just in sunny warm Los Angeles.

This is a great video and has been posted before, there are similar videos that are out there from different places around the world. This isn't a problem unique to LA it illustrates the fact that has been discussed at length on this thread. The infrastructure just isn't there. The basic start up is already failing to meed the demand and to get sufficient chargers that work (99+% of the time like gas pumps do) to meet a full transition will likely never happen.