F1 2024: US GP - Austin (Oct 20)

[///M Power-Belgium]

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[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by GuidoK

true.
In hindsight Lando should've given that place back right away, so he could try to overtake Max again.
But if he could've extended his lead with an extra second, this was the right move....

But what a race!
I always liked this track with those awesome Senna S'ses and corners with double apex'es, but with the new top layer smoothing out the bumps it's gotten even better

The problem with Nor giving back the position is, he likely would have never gotten it back. With a much faster car he could barely get close to Max, whose racing and defense were pure brilliance, and he only managed to pass when he went off track. He was lucky because he should have a gotten two 5 second penalties IMO - one for going off a 4th time and 2 for the passing off track. Either way, Max forced Nor into that big mistake as well as him making a couple small ones. And talk about multiple moved by Not when Max had DRS on him on the main straight.
All in all, good weekend for Max, and a step forward. Does anyone know why they didn’t bring their flexi front wing? It wasn’t in the upgrade docs…
What else do they have coming for Mexico and Brazil?

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls

Driver/skill diff. McLaren/Lando lost that on their own again due to another bad start.

Yes, Nor has had the fastest car for way more races than anyone and barely any wins to show for it.
I was hoping Max would pull an Alo (ala Aus on Rus) in the esses to cause Nor to slip up and spin. Either way, I think Max’s ability to defend like no other frustrated Nor knowing he had a much faster car and just doesn’t have the ability, skill, or race craft to pass post haste like Max would have in the same car.

[Artemis]

Controversial. Elbows out by both.

[G30M]

Originally Posted by E92inNC

I’m curious to hear from RB as to why they just let Max get undercut. Did they not think P2 was their race?

probably safer to cover Lando being Max's direct competitor instead of covering Sainz?

[G30M]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

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report card on Checo from Horner: well done, certificate of excellence award

[GuidoK]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

The problem with Nor giving back the position is, he likely would have never gotten it back. With a much faster car he could barely get close to Max, whose racing and defense were pure brilliance, and he only managed to pass when he went off track.

Yes, that is a possibility.
And of course if one car is going off track doesn't mean you are allowed to pass that car off track

I wonder what would've happened if Lando backed out of that moment, not passing Max off track but let him go, and McLaren making a complaint with the stewards.
Could Max have gotten a penalty at that point for going off track and gaining an advantage or forcing another car off track, or would it have been judged as a track limit violation (4 allowed)?

But it's racing at it's hardest. Elbows out as Artemis said For both, so these things will happen and the FIA has to play the referee. In that case it's very important how the rules are exactly set. In this case they they went the apex route.
I'm sure we'll see more moments similar to this one in the rest of the racing season so we can expect some close racing and questionable moments to come (and 1 or 2 crashes I fear )

[M5Rick]

On conclusion we can see Lando is trying more things after losing out on the hairpin at the start, we saw Charlie wanting to make the same manoeuvre as MAX at the exact same time then quickly placing himself back to power out of the bend better in the middle as MAX and LAN drifted outside in their acute angle trajectory.

[fs1977]

Originally Posted by toxik

race was very underwhelming, i enjoyed the lando vs max long battle but the climax was disappointing. F1 should’ve given lando p3 just to make the season slightly more exciting, it’s not like he didn’t deserve it and imo he was going to overtake max regardless, he had better pace and tires.

So you would rather have the stewards not following the rulebook just for the sake of more excitement the rest of the season? I don't think that would be the route to go

And having the better pace and tires doesn't automatically means also overtaking, we saw that the many laps before

[wizardofOz]

Originally Posted by GuidoK

With or without?

With....to help with digestion

[wizardofOz]

In hindsight, Lando probably could have made it easier on himself by trying to overtake Max AFTER the last corner of the track and on the straight with DRS - given how close he was to Max at that point anyway, possibly overdid himself trying to attack Max where he did.

[G30M]

Originally Posted by GuidoK

And of course if one car is going off track doesn't mean you are allowed to pass that car off track
...
and the FIA has to play the referee. In that case it's very important how the rules are exactly set.

in Lap 1 Sainz pushed Max off the track and Max was not penalized for keeping his position, very similar to Lando. in the Sainz case both cars went off the track.

if you have replay you can watch Lap 1. similar incidents. Ferrari however didn't protest and nothing was noted.

[fs1977]

Very not similar. Verstappen held the position that he was in before the corner, Lando was behind Verstappen before the corner and gained a position by going off.

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by G30M

in Lap 1 Sainz pushed Max off the track and Max was not penalized for keeping his position, very similar to Lando. in the Sainz case both cars went off the track.

if you have replay you can watch Lap 1. similar incidents. Ferrari however didn't protest and nothing was noted.

I think on the first lap going off track for any reason apart from contact/collision is not counted by stewards. In that case the one who is judged the hitter can get penalty.

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by wizardofOz

In hindsight, Lando probably could have made it easier on himself by trying to overtake Max AFTER the last corner of the track and on the straight with DRS - given how close he was to Max at that point anyway, possibly overdid himself trying to attack Max where he did.

Perhaps without the banned bendy and 'opening corner gaps' in the rear wing the Laren's DRS was not so effective as before and now can't cope so well with the 20's straight speed.

[wizardofOz]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

Perhaps without the banned bendy and 'opening corner gaps' in the rear wing the Laren's DRS was not so effective as before and now can't cope so well with the 20's straight speed.

That's possible, I'm basing this off the last few laps where he had more tyres left on his car than Max and how he ate at the gap. I just personally think he could have thought twice.

Fair play to the Ferrari's and RB

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by wizardofOz

That's possible, I'm basing this off the last few laps where he had more tyres left on his car than Max and how he ate at the gap. I just personally think he could have thought twice.

For sure LAN could catch up with his main DRS flap open but not as quickly as in previous races giving MAX that crucial split second more time to position for block which he did with accuracy despite LAN even having a bit more tyre grip.

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by GuidoK

Yes, that is a possibility.
And of course if one car is going off track doesn't mean you are allowed to pass that car off track

I wonder what would've happened if Lando backed out of that moment, not passing Max off track but let him go, and McLaren making a complaint with the stewards.
Could Max have gotten a penalty at that point for going off track and gaining an advantage or forcing another car off track, or would it have been judged as a track limit violation (4 allowed)?

But it's racing at it's hardest. Elbows out as Artemis said For both, so these things will happen and the FIA has to play the referee. In that case it's very important how the rules are exactly set. In this case they they went the apex route.
I'm sure we'll see more moments similar to this one in the rest of the racing season so we can expect some close racing and questionable moments to come (and 1 or 2 crashes I fear )

That's a tight corner and Max got to the apex first. The problem for Nor was Mclaren thinking he was there first when Max had the inside line and was ahead. They need to be honest and tell him he was not ahead. The stewards were pretty consistent in this corner where when you take the inside you need to entire area to track out and it leaves no space. The alternative would not hitting the apex and trying to get on the power earlier to the left, but then you lose the inside line on the next corner too.
I am hopeful RBR keeps bringing pace to the car because once again we saw what Max can do with the 3rd fastest car.
I would also like to see Nor DNF once or twice...he is truly one of the biggest asses in F1. Norass is what he should be called for his incessant whining.

[MoeTE87]

Pretty awesome race but very surprised Red Bull (aka Max) couldn't get it done and keep pace with Ferrari. Max was strong all weekend then nothing come race time. Granted he finished 3rd but I could have sworn he would have finished #1 after watching him all weekend! Crazy stuff!

Maybe this weekend? No one knows anymore.

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

For sure LAN could catch up with his main DRS flap open but not as quickly as in previous races giving MAX that crucial split second more time to position for block which he did with accuracy despite LAN even having a bit more tyre grip.

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[toxik]

Originally Posted by fs1977

So you would rather have the stewards not following the rulebook just for the sake of more excitement the rest of the season? I don't think that would be the route to go

And having the better pace and tires doesn't automatically means also overtaking, we saw that the many laps before

we didn’t see stewards rule the other way for running people off the track multiple times earlier in the race? their ruling is subjective

i'm a mclaren fan, yes i would want to see things go the other way. as if stewards ruling is black and white and their calls can never be questioned right?

[GuidoK]

Originally Posted by toxik

and their calls can never be questioned right?

Teams/drivers have the right to appeal every decision of the stewards.
But in the end someone has to be the referee in a match.