Cost of ownership for a ICE BMW

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by TiMSport

If anything, I would think the latest gen cars should be more reliable, no? I own a brand new G20 and love it. I don't put many miles on my cars as my commutes are extremely short. I take good care of my cars as well. Seems like issues these days with new cars are more prone to electronic stuff more than mechanical. I'd like to think these electronic issues are easier and cheaper to resolve. Though I haven't put many miles on the M340i yet, it has been flawless and feels extremely robust. I don't know, we'll see how I feel after 3 years. The payoff for it will be extremely tempting compared to what I'd be able to buy in comparison for the same price range. I like the idea of it being an inline 6 ICE because they won't be made for that much longer. Hmm.

I think BMW electrics and plastics have gotten far better as time had progressed from the 1980s. The non-turbo drivetrains are mostly bulletproof. The first return to gas turbos with the N54 showed a little downturn in reliability, but the N55 seemed to recover a bit. The newer 4-cylinder engines I don't know much about. But I think it is fair to say any turbo will be with higher maintenance costs simply because of part content increases and heat.

[M5Rick]

Have owned my M over four years and it's only oil service and inspections every year which are virtually nothing,the odd couple tyres, the huge brake pads last forever, but then I'm easy on my M. Okay the fuel is not great but what do you spend.. 83k?? on a new e vehicle you will have much more fun with a gas M and no hassle with charging or the killing cost of a new i battery(ies) with the other foibles of a sparky car.

[Mein11]

When I had a 128i the maintenance between 50k miles and about 200k was brakes, tires, battery once, starter, valve cover gasket & oil filter housing gasket. Honestly was a great car, traded it in with 220k when all the electric gremlins started popping up.

[MsGoGoMoto]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

Have owned my M over four years and it's only oil service and inspections every year which are virtually nothing,the odd couple tyres, the huge brake pads last forever, but then I'm easy on my M. Okay the fuel is not great but what do you spend.. 83k?? on a new e vehicle you will have much more fun with a gas M and no hassle with charging or the killing cost of a new i battery(ies) with the other foibles of a sparky car.

That M5 seems to be pretty slick!
I saw one the other day and thought about you that thing sounded like a monster pulling off at the light. One thing about my i3. If my windows are down, I hear everything outside at "idle"

The thought of 83k is killing me, but it will probably be the last new car my husband will ever buy he's 59 1/2 and just retired. That car will probably last 15 years since it won't be a daily driver. I want to keep my i3 as long as i can.. it's the first car I've ever enjoyed looking forward to driving. I actually pet the car as i lock it up and charge it.

I don't want another gasoline powered car.

I haven't been to a gas station in 3 months
3 MONTHS!

I keep 20 gallons in (4) 5 gallon gas cans for my bike so I can just fill and go.

[MsGoGoMoto]

Originally Posted by Mein11

When I had a 128i the maintenance between 50k miles and about 200k was brakes, tires, battery once, starter, valve cover gasket & oil filter housing gasket. Honestly was a great car, traded it in with 220k when all the electric gremlins started popping up.

220k is pretty good!

My 03 dodge Dakota has 210ish and just now has a main rear seal oil leak.

The rubber boots at my front end are still original and in great shape.

I've had the radiator replaced, top hose, tyres, brakes, water pump fuel pump

That's it. Just shy of 20 years. I can drive it from Georgia to California and not blink.. I'd be cursing the fuel consumption though. After we went back to the office post COVID, it took a week of fueling the tank to push me to an EV

I guess it's how you drive a car as well. Go easy like an take care of it.

[mapleleaf1773]

Originally Posted by MsGoGoMoto

I've heard nothing good about CVTs. They say nissans are the worst with them.
I had a maxima as a company vehicle. It didn't drive too bad. Once I got into a BMW, all other cars now suck.

Same with my BMW k1200rs bike.

My Honda CBR 600, Yamaha Fz1, are now sub par to the BMW.

I'm used to owning a car 20yrs. With the i3, that means at least one new battery. I've already looked into cost.

Pain.

Agreed, my wife had a pathfinder. The CVT went out after the coolant lines separated in the radiator and made the strawberry milkshake of bad news in the tranny while delaminating the gears.

That being said, 1 company in Michigan remans those specific CVT trannies. All electrical bs and very expensive to replace. Can you tell I'm still sour ? Lol

[MsGoGoMoto]

Originally Posted by mapleleaf1773

Agreed, my wife had a pathfinder. The CVT went out after the coolant lines separated in the radiator and made the strawberry milkshake of bad news in the tranny while delaminating the gears.

That being said, 1 company in Michigan remans those specific CVT trannies. All electrical bs and very expensive to replace. Can you tell I'm still sour ? Lol

Got damn.
What year was that pathfinder?

[zx10guy]

With regard to the CVTs, the issue you had along with mapleleaf1773 had was you both bought Nissans. It's a known thing that the Jatco CVTs are $hit. While we all agree CVTs are $hit in general, the Asin trans used in Toyotas and the internal house trans used in Hondas are far more reliable.

[vreihen16]

Originally Posted by MsGoGoMoto

That's it. Just shy of 20 years. I can drive it from Georgia to California and not blink.. I'd be cursing the fuel consumption though. After we went back to the office post COVID, it took a week of fueling the tank to push me to an EV

My wife's 2007 Dakota (rare 6-speed manual V6) had 267K when she finally let it go, and replaced it with her Kia Niro BEV. The gas on her 100 mile round-trip commute was costing her $20/day. The Niro cost $3.25/day in electrons if charged at home, and was free on most days because there was a free L2 charger next to where she worked.

The cost of owning a German vehicle isn't helped by the euro being so high against the dollar for the past two decades. That being said, the total cost of my i3 ownership in 2.5 years so far has been a set of wiper blades, round of tires, brake fluid flush, and this week's 12V aux battery failure. Yes, it finally gave up the ghost after 6 years.....

[DETRoadster]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

Have owned my M over four years and it's only oil service and inspections every year which are virtually nothing,the odd couple tyres, the huge brake pads last forever, but then I'm easy on my M. Okay the fuel is not great but what do you spend.. 83k?? on a new e vehicle you will have much more fun with a gas M and no hassle with charging or the killing cost of a new i battery(ies) with the other foibles of a sparky car.

That's been my experience as well. I bought a VERY early M2. I was #2 in the Seattle area to take delivery back in December of 2016. It's been nothing but oil changes every year and 1 warranty repair to fix the "I just ran over a trashcan lid" sound that came from the rear brake shield, that most owners seemed to experience. That's literally been it for 5 years. I have a dedicated set of snow tires that I swap over for 5 months of the year so I'm even still on the OEM set of summer tires.

[Hawkeye]

I have owned my z4 for 14 years and would say, if you take care of the vehicle it is not much different than other brands. You will want to find an indy or do stuff yourself because the dealership put a high value on their tech's time, which is where a lot of the cost comes in it seems.

[TiMSport]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

I think BMW electrics and plastics have gotten far better as time had progressed from the 1980s. The non-turbo drivetrains are mostly bulletproof. The first return to gas turbos with the N54 showed a little downturn in reliability, but the N55 seemed to recover a bit. The newer 4-cylinder engines I don't know much about. But I think it is fair to say any turbo will be with higher maintenance costs simply because of part content increases and heat.

The B58 engine seems to be pretty solid and I don't recall hearing any stories of major failures, knock on wood. I think BMW has improved the design to reduce engine wear and even emissions. The big question mark is long term reliability of the new 48v mild-hybrid setup. So far this has proven to be one of the best cars I've owned to date but I keep my eyes and ears open on the fellows that own the 2020 model and have relatively high miles racked up. As I said, I haven't heard of any major issues so far.

[Alfisti]

How on earth any of you in the USA can justify an electric car given how cheap your gas is, is beyond me. You must be doing an absolute SHIT TON of miles.

We are rapidly approaching $2 a litre ($8 gallon) for premium here.

[Manny01]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

How on earth any of you in the USA can justify an electric car given how cheap your gas is, is beyond me. You must be doing an absolute SHIT TON of miles.

We are rapidly approaching $2 a litre ($8 gallon) for premium here.

Most total cost of ownership calculations I've seen show that, apples to apples, ICE is cheaper over the short- and mid-term. EV is cheaper long-term and/or when the miles are very high (although battery replacement remains a wild card).

People buying EVs in the U.S. are driven primarily by environmental concerns, technology, novelty, performance, and being early adopters. Long-term cost is low on the list.

[W///]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

How on earth any of you in the USA can justify an electric car given how cheap your gas is, is beyond me. You must be doing an absolute SHIT TON of miles.

We are rapidly approaching $2 a litre ($8 gallon) for premium here.

I'd be bankrupt trying to run the cars I have now, even though my commute is not all that long.

I'm not against getting an electric car in the future, but it would be more for convenience, rather than to save money on gas (although that would be nice).

As far as BMW, the current gas burning ones can be worked on at home or at most shops. Electric ones, should something go wrong, would mean an automatic trip to the dealership at the moment. There's just no data on how cars past say 2010 will do in 20 years, just because things like self driving and EV system really ramped up the past few years.

[zx10guy]

Originally Posted by Manny01

Most total cost of ownership calculations I've seen show that, apples to apples, ICE is cheaper over the short- and mid-term. EV is cheaper long-term and/or when the miles are very high (although battery replacement remains a wild card).

People buying EVs in the U.S. are driven primarily by environmental concerns, technology, novelty, performance, and being early adopters. Long-term cost is low on the list.

You forget the subsidies in the form of tax breaks and in many locals, free access to HOV lanes.

[bigrum]

Over 25 years I've owned two Hondas (heavily modified) two Subarus, a Ford, and a Toyota as well as my F80. The BMW is far and away higher priced in all categories: Car payment, insurance, registration (based on value), maintenance costs and frequency. One example is my spark plugs and oil had to be changed, that's over a thousand dollars at a dealership or even a reputable private shop around here and I only had the car a year at that point (bought it used with ~12k miles on it). None of my other cars have needed as much maintenance so quickly or cost so much to own. Even for my gasoline engine I hear the cost of needing to get your battery programmed if it ever dies, you can't just go to the store and buy a new one.

[dreamingat30fps]

I guess I'm in the minority that has never really given any thought to maintenance costs of vehicles I purchase. Usually I will sell the car before the warranty runs out, not because of reliability concerns, I just get bored and buy too many cars. The ones I keep longer and are out of warranty are usually paid off and any maintenance I have ever had has been less than a monthly car payment.

I havent't had any recent BMWs but the longest car I owned was my 2006 Z4MR that I had for like 5-6 years. I did oil changes myself, honestly didn't do valve adjustments but maybe once at a local BMW shop. Other than that I don't recall doing much maintenance. I would to brakes myself and towards the end before selling the alternator went and it was like around $300 at the local BMW shop to have it replaced.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by TiMSport

The B58 engine seems to be pretty solid and I don't recall hearing any stories of major failures, knock on wood. I think BMW has improved the design to reduce engine wear and even emissions. The big question mark is long term reliability of the new 48v mild-hybrid setup. So far this has proven to be one of the best cars I've owned to date but I keep my eyes and ears open on the fellows that own the 2020 model and have relatively high miles racked up. As I said, I haven't heard of any major issues so far.

With the latest turbos, BMW got smart and made the engine block a closed-deck design. IIRC, now all engine blocks are shared between diesel and turbo gas engines. That is the right design philosophy to follow.

[Alfisti]

How is an EV more convenient? You've got to keep plugging the fucker in instead of just filling up say once a week.

[MsGoGoMoto]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

How on earth any of you in the USA can justify an electric car given how cheap your gas is, is beyond me. You must be doing an absolute SHIT TON of miles.

We are rapidly approaching $2 a litre ($8 gallon) for premium here.

We are spread out here.
I drive 40 miles 67k one way to work from home.
Doing that in a V8 4x4 pickup truck sucked ass.
With the i3. I charge it for free at the laundry mat across the street from work.

I don't pay jack in juice to drive the car.

[MsGoGoMoto]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

How is an EV more convenient? You've got to keep plugging the fucker in instead of just filling up say once a week.

I sounded like you…. Until I became an actual owner.
Now, not going back.
Just have to select the car with range and adjust your routine.
I thought charging would be a nightmare. I freaked the first week. Now… nope. I got enough range 180miles to get to work, run around to projects, and get home with plenty of range left. I just plug it in the wall in the garage 120v receptacle. Boom.
Also 4 Free fast charging stations a mile from the house. I park and go walking and charged in an hour.
Low maintenance
No gas
I effing love it after driving a big as gas guzzling truck to work with $400 in fuel costs a month. $400. A MONTH!

Now I can upgrade my motorcycle with the gas money I saved.

Still have the truck. Got to keep a truck!