F1 2021: Italian GP - Monza (Sep 12)

[Steeler]

Page 17 can go right in the scrap bin except for HFW's post.

[Bongoxxx]

All this he said in this blog, and she said in that blog and this former racer said this blah, blah, blah, blah…it all doesn’t matter.

The stewards made their decision - MAX predominantly at fault and a 3 grid penalty.
That’s ALL that matters.

Now back to the regularly scheduled programming of whining, complaining, conspiracy theories posted by the usual suspects.

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by dbarton62

Page 17 can go right in the scrap bin except for HFW's post.

Well that includes your one too, seriously tho you can just skip our posts if you don't like them and it's not as if you come up with something eye opening, huh?

[minn19]

Originally Posted by GuidoK

As usual Randy Pobst is jumping to conclusions without having all the information...
He says " Can Lewis see you at this point? No, he’s looking the other way at the apex."
But that is not the issue. HAM knew VER was there.
Everyone can verify that because his team told him so over the radio.....TWICE

First when leaving the pits, his team says "it's gonna be tight on exit", and just before steering into the chicane: "Verstappen with you now".
And you can see VER both in the mirror and in the cameraview you see his front wing (so that would porbably have been in his peripheral vision). So when his team said "VER with you now" and HAM really wanted to exactly pinpoint VER position, he could have glanced in his mirror for a fraction of a second even before entering the chicane..

And it's of course doubtful that HAM can enter the exact same chicane and leave enough room for NOR, see @0:13:
(apparently HAM didn't have an issue seeing NOR, but I don't hear Pobst about that)

But apparently not enough room when VER sits in the same position as NOR when entering the chicane. (see @3:03)

So Pobst argument of HAM not seeing VER or not knowing he's there is imho absolute moot.
And HAM&NOR passing next to eachother through the same chicane without NOR being forced on that sausage curb proves that there is enough room for 2 cars in that chicane, unless 1 driver decides not to.

I wonder if HAM decided the right thing colliding with VER, and VER extending his lead by 2 points but having 3 gridplaces penalty.
HAM came right out of the pits with 100% new tyres. In the chicane just after the start, while leaving enough room for NOR, HAM still came out fastest.
So I don't see how this would go different with VER.
So I think HAM made the wrong bet, with both having a good chance coming fastest out of the chicane like what happened with NOR, and coming just from the pit, maybe being faster than VER in general on that first lap so if not faster through that chicane, maybe oppertunity to pass him anyway, being right behind VER.

But eventually we"ll see in Sochi if VER takes a new PU and see the results (I think HAM also still needs to take a new PU)

You are bagging on and insulting others for their knowledge compared to other professional drivers and you come up with this steaming pile of excrement.

Haven't the stewards spoken and that's all that matters? I feel like someone here has said that over and over again.

Edit: NOR was fully alongside HAM at the start of the race. VER wasn't and tried the divebomb which obviously didn't work. In your world if you tell someone that a car is on your rear quarter panel and then they turn into said person it's their fault because they knew they were there? Knowing someone's relative position is a lot different than knowing what their next action/intent is. But, it was Max and pretty much everyone knew he was going to do something impulsive (or like you guys say dirty tricks) like this.

[GuidoK]

Originally Posted by minn19

and then they turn into said person it's their fault because they knew they were there?

I never said anything about it being "someone's fault"....

The crew warned HAM about VER.

And here he was, front wing almost touching his front wheel.



And I'm also not contradicting the stewards. In fact, I haven't said anything about them regarding this matter. You're typical trying to put words in my mouth again. That's really sad...

[minn19]

Originally Posted by GuidoK

I never said anything about it being "someone's fault"....

The crew warned HAM about VER.

And here he was, front wing almost touching his front wheel.



And I'm also not contradicting the stewards. In fact, I haven't said anything about them regarding this matter. You're typical trying to put words in my mouth again. That's really sad...

You are so full of it with that screenshot and this post. The way NOR entered was much more in control. They were basically side by side down the entire straight and through the corner at the start of the race. Max came diving in from a later breaking maneuver that was in a direction from back and to the left. Randy was right, HAM is looking through the corner and VER is in a very hard part to see from his vantage point. Almost a complete blindspot. Yes his crew radioed he was there. You are smart enough to know that they are moving so fast that they can't give a second by second update on his exact position. Bono should of radioed something like this; "remember, Max is an entitled spoiled brat that expects everyone to move out of his way and give him space even though he didn't for you in the exact same spot a few laps ago. Also he never does for any of his fellow drivers.

And yes you are assigning blame. You are saying Lewis didn't leave him enough room between an apples and oranges comparison. At least own it. Sad, GTFO with that crap, you aren't Trump.

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by GuidoK

I never said anything about it being "someone's fault"....

The crew warned HAM about VER.

And here he was, front wing almost touching his front wheel.



And I'm also not contradicting the stewards. In fact, I haven't said anything about them regarding this matter. You're typical trying to put words in my mouth again. That's really sad...

Perfect pic Guido of Max alongside,Ham clearly seing him unless he closes eyes and turning into him making no attempt to avoid a collision.

[SenorFunkyPants]

It was a pass or crash overtake attempt by verstappen...he knew he was better off punting Hamilton off the track than let him take the lead.

[minn19]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

Perfect pic Guido of Max alongside,Ham clearly seing him unless he closes eyes and turning into him making no attempt to avoid a collision.

Glad you agree it was Max’s fault then at Silverstone……..

[MKSixer]

Originally Posted by minn19

You are bagging on and insulting others for their knowledge compared to other professional drivers and you come up with this steaming pile of excrement.

Haven't the stewards spoken and that's all that matters? I feel like someone here has said that over and over again.

Edit: NOR was fully alongside HAM at the start of the race. VER wasn't and tried the divebomb which obviously didn't work. In your world if you tell someone that a car is on your rear quarter panel and then they turn into said person it's their fault because they knew they were there? Knowing someone's relative position is a lot different than knowing what their next action/intent is. But, it was Max and pretty much everyone knew he was going to do something impulsive (or like you guys say dirty tricks) like this.

Well said. Here is evidence from a LONGTIME Lewis Hamilton Hater, Sir Jackie Stewart. Even HE says that Max needs to mature before something serious happens.

https://firstsportz.com/formula-1-gr...l4alJL4r0OkVFo

[MKSixer]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

Perfect pic Guido of Max alongside,Ham clearly seing him unless he closes eyes and turning into him making no attempt to avoid a collision.

He is visually alongside Sir Lewis but not "racing" alongside Sir Lewis. There is a huge difference. At no point does Max's front wheel draw even with Sir Lewis's front wheel in the entire sequence.

Max. Is. At. Fault. (Predominantly, for the sake of accuracy.)

[Steeler]

MIAF, lets remember that acronym for future reference.

Carry on.

[Ngilbe36]

This forum is like the Twilight Zone.

Over 1000 posts arguing that front wheel to front wheel going into the corner is not alongside and now the same people arguing that front wheel to barge boards is alongside.

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by Bubbles

Hammy lost it here, even if he got loose safety he would have backed into oncoming traffic. He is coming unhinged.

Max 's underside of car holding that 12 real tight there.

[GuidoK]

Originally Posted by minn19

And yes you are assigning blame.

No I'm not. I just compare 2 different scenario's

All the arguments like "HAM couldn't see Max", "They were driving too fast" are all moot.

The stewards say themselves: "While car 44 could have steered further from the curb to avoid the accident"
So it WAS possible. But the main point is: HAM didn't have to do that.
He was far enough ahead to not having to do that, to keep the racing line.
Those are the words of the stewards.
And so he did. So to me this was a choice, a decision.
And I wonder if this was the right decision. Crashing with Max, potentially damaging your car (happened), and Max increasing his lead albeit with a grid penalty that he might combine with a new PU.
Even letting Max have the inside corner would still have given HAM the chance to come out first of that chicane, like what happened at the start when HAM went into the chicane with NOR the same way, but leaving room for him, and HAM still came out first.

Of course the same thing can be said about Max. Him getting in that tight spot while not even or ahead. Risking a crash (happened) and a potential penalty (happened). Wouldn't Max be able to overtake HAM in the next corner? Finishing above HAM and extending his lead even further?
His racepace was faster most of the weekend.

So with both drivers I wonder if this outcome was best for them (obviously its best for one of them, but I cant say who)

Originally Posted by minn19

This steaming pile of excrement.

Originally Posted by minn19

GTFO with that crap, you aren't Trump.

So what's with the language? Why can't you articulate your posts in a normal, civilized way?
And what's with the political reference?

[M5Rick]

Lesson for Ham. ''That's what you get when you don't leave the space''.

[tdott]

Originally Posted by Ngilbe36

This forum is like the Twilight Zone.

Over 1000 posts arguing that front wheel to front wheel going into the corner is not alongside and now the same people arguing that front wheel to barge boards is alongside.

....plus the one who never leaves room, cries when he runs himself out of room.

[minn19]

Originally Posted by GuidoK

No I'm not. I just compare 2 different scenario's

All the arguments like "HAM couldn't see Max", "They were driving too fast" are all moot.

The stewards say themselves: "While car 44 could have steered further from the curb to avoid the accident"
So it WAS possible. But the main point is: HAM didn't have to do that.
He was far enough ahead to not having to do that, to keep the racing line.
Those are the words of the stewards.
And so he did. So to me this was a choice, a decision.
And I wonder if this was the right decision. Crashing with Max, potentially damaging your car (happened), and Max increasing his lead albeit with a grid penalty that he might combine with a new PU.
Even letting Max have the inside corner would still have given HAM the chance to come out first of that chicane, like what happened at the start when HAM went into the chicane with NOR the same way, but leaving room for him, and HAM still came out first.

Of course the same thing can be said about Max. Him getting in that tight spot while not even or ahead. Risking a crash (happened) and a potential penalty (happened). Wouldn't Max be able to overtake HAM in the next corner? Finishing above HAM and extending his lead even further?
His racepace was faster most of the weekend.

So with both drivers I wonder if this outcome was best for them (obviously its best for one of them, but I cant say who)





So what's with the language? Why can't you articulate your posts in a normal, civilized way?
And what's with the political reference?

Give me a break with all of this. Now you are playing the victim to after going after MKSixer especially hard and others?

You guys want it only Max's way period every time and can never bring yourself to admit he did something wrong. Thanks for the entertainment, please keep posting hypocritical nonsense as I need a laugh by this time of the day.

Edit: I look forward to you admonishing your buddies when they go way more over the top than I do and also bring in political references.

[minn19]

We should do a poll as to what everyones thinks would've happened if HAM gave Max room. I'm betting the same thing that happened earlier in the race. Max would've not left room for Lewis and made him make the choice again to crash or bail out on the next/last corner of the chicane.

[minn19]

GuidoK, your own video :34 in. Why doesn't Max have to leave Lewis room here?

This is exactly what would've happened later had Lewis saw Max in time and moved over to avoid the crash. You guys wouldn't of said a thing about leaving room.

[GuidoK]

Originally Posted by minn19

Give me a break with all of this.....

Yet I use civilized words and don't use political statements in the process.
It's best to refrain from making political statements, that forumsection has been removed for good reason.

Besides, making statements without swearwords etc. are imho more effective and striking. But you seem to think differently and seem to need those words to express your feelings and opinions.

[GuidoK]

Originally Posted by minn19

Why doesn't Max have to leave Lewis room here?

I didn't say HAM had to leave room for VER.
So it's beyond me what point you're trying to make and proove here.